The Ship Model Forum

Hey guys, here is a link to the tug on the water. :) Just copy and paste into your browser :thumbs_up_1:
http://youtu.be/zSGnJ1oPkzE
New prop on her from Raboesch works a treat.

Hey Neptune,
It is a large radius of turn, but I was only running it on 1/4 speed. Wasn't game to open her up flat out until on the lake. For a vessel without Bilge keels she has surprisingly little roll. I am planning on keeping her electric and not doing anything further to her at this time. As a future upgrade, I may re-do the Wheelhouse and make all the lights work, put in a smoke generator and a horn simulator. For now, just happy to have finished it to the point where the wife can use it (play with it :heh: )
The plates on the sides are stainless steel, hard to work with. The stuff is hard and doesn't drill or file anywhere near as easily as mild steel or other soft metals. If I get a chance over the weekend, or early next week, will see what I can do about some lake footage :thumbs_up_1:
Thanks for the post.
Regards to all

Looks like a relatively large turning radius. (just an observation, no pun intended). Great boat though!!! Did you run her full speed already?
Of course we are interested to see her in more open waters.
Love the detailing of those plates on the bulwark, it really gives the extra touch. Are you planning to keep the motor or do you intend to make a steam plant in the end? And are you going to add a smoke generator if you don't make the steamplant?

G'day guys,
Well, Since the last post just could not get the time I needed to build the steam plant, so bought another electric motor and put it in, made a 5mm to 10mm coupler with a rubber universal joint.
[attachment=2]tn_IMG_3308.JPG[/attachment]
I made this from a piece of bronze rod and made the grub screws from a couple of small bolts and filed in the screw driver slot. All simple stuff there. The motor is mounted on a plate of aluminium that was bent and drilled to fit the motor and this was glued to the bulkheads with epoxy glue. I then bought a large battery, placed it in the hull and used Styrofoam to lock it into position and with the radio gear fitted, put it into a half full bath and started the ballasting process. I needed just over a kilogram of lead sinkers and these were also glued in with epoxy glue.
[attachment=1]tn_IMG_3306.JPG[/attachment]
Here she is floating at the right depth and ready to go.

Here is a link to the youtube video of her going around a mates pool:- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMq_zAXo0ME&feature=youtu.be
[attachment=0]tn_IMG_3320.JPG[/attachment]
After her first dip, checked the interior and to my great relief, no water. Looks like the "o" ring and the bronze bushes did there job well. :thumbs_up_1: :woo_hoo:
Boss is now happy, her tug is ready to ply the waters of the lakes just down the road from us. If there is any interest, I will take some footage of the event and post the link to the youtube video.
I thank everyone for their interest. The plans for the next addition to the Flotilla haven't arrived yet, however, it will have the hull entirely built of steel. :big_grin:
Final note, after adding up all the receipts I could find for bits and pieces, including the radio gear, motor, batteries and plans $486 AUS. Radio gear, motor and ESC came from Hobbyking, the rest came from Loyalhanna. (this was not meant to be a plug, just info)

Hi, Gav!
Yes, it is wery interesting to see your work with the motor- especially the "table probes"! And how you want to solve problems with the "dead start" (You will use only two cylinders if I don't mistaked) and with a direction of the rotation- may be, combination with a electrical motor?
Keep us updating!
With best regards-
Anatoly

G'day Anatoly,
Don't know how much run time I will get, all part of the experimentation. Would likely be only wanting a max rotation of 600rpm anyway, otherwise scale hull speed may be a bit high. I am looking to do this to try to do something different. I will bench run it first, make sure everything runs smooth, time it, tinker, if it doesn't work, I can still install an electric. Both the electric and compressed air scenarios have a negligible weight loss while running and so trim isn't an issue. As for a decent run time and the pressure required, if I can get up to a 10 minute run time, I will be happy. I believe that is where the fun really starts in this hobby. We never stop learning and at some point someone will come up with something that will really rock the minds of all of us.
I really enjoy this sort of discussion, I value you opinions and weigh up the options as you pose them. :thumbs_up_1: Please don't consider I am ignoring your warning, I appreciate it and consider my next move accordingly. Besides, if the steam engine doesn't work, I can sell it on ebay and at least get my money back, seem to be a few people out there like little steam engines :heh: (me included). Thanks for reading, and I look forward to more. On Monday I hope to start building the motor. If anyone wants me to post pics of the engine build, just ask and I will add this, else, I will just continue once I have completed building the motor.
Regards,
Gav

Hi, Gav!
Let me to play with digits a little bit.
For example, you have a ballon (a fire extinguisher) with 1 litre capacity. If ( even if !!!) you put 10 bars in the ballon, and if we take 2 bars as a working pressure, it means 4,5 liter of "fuel" (after a reduction, of course). Let us take the working space of your motor 1 cub. sm. It means 4500 cycles only! With 1000 rpm of the propeller (it is normal) you have as a maximum 5 minuts for floating!
Is it correct or there is a something wrong?

With best wishes-
Anatoly.

G'day Anatoly,
No, a simple steam engine with a pressure container like a fire extinguisher hooked up through a valve and a guage so that it can be refilled and set to a constant pressure, and hook that directly to a steam engine, you just need the oiler to keep everything free in the cylinders. Made from Stainless and Brass, the thing should run nicely.
Don't know about a new direction in model building, but I know the stem won't dent and the keel won't buckle :big_grin: I just used materials I had available at the time so I could save some money on the build.
Will take a few months to build the motor, but I reckon it should look good and I can set the throw of the crank and put her inline.

Hi, Gav!
Really, you have a good reserve! I am glad that my warnings were waste. So, you have a wide field for experiments! The steam motor with a compressed air? hmmm... Do you mean a pneumatic motor? Or CO2 motor? In any case, in combination with the welded steel frame it can be a brand new step in a shipmodelling!
With best wishes-
Anatoly

[quote="Mickosh3"]Hello, Gav!

Let me to discuss a little bit around the machinery of your model.
The motor your bought , I think, really is more fit for racing (or even flying!) model. The motor can bring you problems with cooling, prop and shaft adjustments,bearings and so on.... Beside it, the motor can eat your battery in very short time!
Why don't you take a good old 5-7 pole DC motor with 20...30 VA power? It is more then enough for your model. If you add a LI-Po battery (f.e. with 2800 mA/h capacity) you can save lots of weight and money and enjoy with floating no less than a hour.
About the weight: if your model takes 6 kilo without a machinery - be careful with your plans regarding a steam engine - the weight may be critical . I advise you to set your model in water (in bath!) as a primary check of your "weight credit"
About the transmition - yes, your frames don't allow to use the direct drive. Why not a cardan shaft with a side motor position?
It is just my opinion!
With best regards - Anatoly[/quote]

G'day Anatoly,
You pose some exceedingly good points. So to determine just how much weight I have to play with, floated the tug in the bath.
The following 2 pics are showing the waterline without ballast. She is very unstable, so had to hold her level.
[attachment=4]Waterline without ballast.JPG[/attachment][attachment=3]Bow without ballast.JPG[/attachment]
As can be seen, she is riding well high of the intended waterline. The very hard to see fine black line is the actual waterline as per the plans ( a little painting to be done..)
The following pics are of the waterline with ballast. Very stable in these shots :thumbs_up_1:
[attachment=2]overall view once ballast added.JPG[/attachment][attachment=1]Ballast in bow view.JPG[/attachment]
I was actually surprised by how much it took to get her to settle down to this depth... so I weighed the ballast and took a photo of it.
[attachment=0]brass ballast used 4795 grams.JPG[/attachment]
That is right, it takes 4.795 kg of weight. Add that to the current weight of 6kg, for a model only 3 feet long, she is a heavy weight. Will be just shy of 11 kg completed.
With that in mind, it may pay to just make up the steam engine, I have the material, and I know they can run quite slow and I will need the ballast anyway.
I must admit Anatoly, I am really surprised by just how much weight was needed. So would appear that I have another project to do to finish this project.... :big_grin: All good fun. Have a plan of a paddleduck steam engine with an oiler so the compressed air doesn't dry out the "O" rings in the cylinders. It isn't very big, it has reverse, so will be perfect. Still have a few bits to add to the superstructure, but overall, the vessel is pretty much done. :woo_hoo:
Please feel free to comment.
Regards,
Gav

Hello, Gav!

Let me to discuss a little bit around the machinery of your model.
The motor your bought , I think, really is more fit for racing (or even flying!) model. The motor can bring you problems with cooling, prop and shaft adjustments,bearings and so on.... Beside it, the motor can eat your battery in very short time!
Why don't you take a good old 5-7 pole DC motor with 20...30 VA power? It is more then enough for your model. If you add a LI-Po battery (f.e. with 2800 mA/h capacity) you can save lots of weight and money and enjoy with floating no less than a hour.
About the weight: if your model takes 6 kilo without a machinery - be careful with your plans regarding a steam engine - the weight may be critical . I advise you to set your model in water (in bath!) as a primary check of your "weight credit"
About the transmition - yes, your frames don't allow to use the direct drive. Why not a cardan shaft with a side motor position?
It is just my opinion!
With best regards - Anatoly

[quote="Mickosh3"]Hi, Gav!
Thank you for the explanations!

About the motor you selected: it has a very quick rotation - 2100 rpm per volt! Brushless! Be careful with it- your model has too big propeller for the rotation - so you need in a reductor- as a minimum 1:5 - it is my opinion. Also, please, pay attention on the motor's cooling system - max. power is 1 kVA - almost a little kettle!
I wish you to win the problems!
Anatoly[/quote]

G'day Anatoly,
Just been laughing about the speed of the motor,.... had visions of the tug up on the plane going like a speed boat. Just my warped sense of humour.
Thanks for the info, was going to direct couple the motor to the shaft and adjust the setting on the Transmitter, but you pose some interesting problems for me to engineer around **head scratch**
As the keel is steel and close to the shaft ( I have 1/2" of clearance and no room to cut into the keel) a gearbox will be complex as the output can't be any greater than that clearance, so little more than an idler gear on the output drive with the reduction above it.... puts the motor high in the hull and will affect the trim...
Will have a look at how it goes with the direct link and if all else fails, will make a small steam engine and run compressed air through it. Have enough room for a small fire extinguisher bottle to re-gas. A twin cylinder with 10mm bore should be adequate (only if I have to of course). That will push a proper launch down the calendar a bit :heh:
What you think Anatoly?
Regards,
Gav

Hi, Gav!
Thank you for the explanations!

About the motor you selected: it has a very quick rotation - 2100 rpm per volt! Brushless! Be careful with it- your model has too big propeller for the rotation - so you need in a reductor- as a minimum 1:5 - it is my opinion. Also, please, pay attention on the motor's cooling system - max. power is 1 kVA - almost a little kettle!
I wish you to win the problems!
Anatoly

[quote="Mickosh3"]Hi, Badkeson!
You are very close to finish - is not it? Congratulations - extremelly interesting to see your model on a water!
I never heard about a model with a steel frame - what is a weight of your model at the moment?
And what is a electrical power of the motor?
And the last foolish question: Why the upperdeck is so dark? The real upperdeck wood is rather gray then brown - it is my opinion. Or there is a something special?
Sorry for lots of questions!
I wish you and your wife to get a real pleasure when the tug will go ahead!

With best wishes -
Anatoly[/quote]

G'day Anatoly,
Thanks for your kind words. I chose to use the steel because I intend to build a mammoth scale ship soon, and was experimenting on a much smaller ship to start with. Steel is very cheep at present and as I have welding gear and the material I decided I would give it a go. Once the frames were aligned and everything was set, went together in seconds and no waiting time for glue. One point though, the welds do pull and as such, warping can happen, so preheating and opposing welds do help. The steel frame in the hull gives the model only a few extra kilos, at the moment, no radio gear and no batteries or motor, the ship weighs 6 kg.
The motor is a Turnigy XK3665-B-2100KV. Don't personally know what all that means, but when I bought it off Hobby King (via internet) was told it would be good for marine applications, have the controller unit and the twin pack of batteries, but I may go to a small motorbike battery if I need more ballast and power.
Mate, no question is foolish, but you caught me out.... that is one of the departures I made. The deck, according to the plans, was a light tan colour, and most tugs pictures I have seen have black decks, or at least dark coloured decks. Didn't want to use more paint, so stained the balsa deck walnut, but didn't seal the balsa first and she went really dark. :big_grin: So that was a monumental boo boo on my part, but the wife liked the colour, so it stayed. I kept the upperdeck as light as possible by not coating it with the CFP satin polyurethane that I used on all the other timber to keep it more "light". The big question now will be how little ballast I will need, she is so bulbous in the hull amidships, I may still need a fair amount to take her down to the waterline. Hope to verify that one soon.
Thanks for your questions,
Gav

Hi, Badkeson!
You are very close to finish - is not it? Congratulations - extremelly interesting to see your model on a water!
I never heard about a model with a steel frame - what is a weight of your model at the moment?
And what is a electrical power of the motor?
And the last foolish question: Why the upperdeck is so dark? The real upperdeck wood is rather gray then brown - it is my opinion. Or there is a something special?
Sorry for lots of questions!
I wish you and your wife to get a real pleasure when the tug will go ahead!

With best wishes -
Anatoly

Had a slow weekend, so not as much done as I would have liked. But I have now attached all the lights, they don't work, but they look the part. Also made the cradle to sit the boat on when it is in the house. Still have to make and fit the life rings, paint the waterline strip, make the bows over the stern, fit the motor and batteries. Then she can have a swim.
[attachment=1]Nearly done 30 June 13.JPG[/attachment][attachment=0]30 June 13.JPG[/attachment]

Anyone who has seen the plans to the "Anteo" will know some of the departures I have made from the real ship. I built this as a scratchbuild and not from an available kit. Will post some more pics soon and in particular will post her maiden voyage and let you know how much extra weight it took for ballast and her empty weight with the steel frame.

G'day all, has been a big day of building and the finish line is in sight...
I started off by fitting a Captain and his little dog into the Wheelhouse. You can see the charts and instrument panels too. This isn't a kit, so this was just a bit of something the wife wanted, so I will keep her happy, her ship after all.
[attachment=9]Captain and his dog in the wheelhouse.JPG[/attachment][attachment=8]Captain and his dog in the wheelhouse 2.JPG[/attachment]
So the Captain doesn't get wet when it rains, I built the roof and put the brass handrail on as an assembly.
[attachment=7]Roof with brass rail attached.JPG[/attachment]
Here is the roof attached to the wheelhouse and the front sections soldered together.
[attachment=6]Wheelhouse roof on with the handrails fitted 2.JPG[/attachment]
Now for a Job I have been dreading for some time, the tow hook. Here are a series of pics showing the raw blocks to the finished product.
[attachment=5]Raw brass blocks for the tow hook.JPG[/attachment][attachment=4]Roughed out hook.JPG[/attachment][attachment=3]Finished hook.JPG[/attachment][attachment=2]Hook attached.JPG[/attachment]
A view from the rear of the wheelhouse. Need to fit the navigation lights and the lights on the front of the mast, some cables from the top of the mast to the rear of the top deck and some cables from the top of the funnel to the top of the smoke box and make and attach six life rings to the wheelhouse parapet railing. That should then be the finish of the wheelhouse.
[attachment=1]Close to finished.JPG[/attachment]
last pic of the day, apart from what needs finishing on the wheelhouse, still have to make the bows that cover the rear of the hull, put the letters of the name of the ship across the stern and that should just about cover the exterior. Then it will be the final fit out of radio gear and motor, a test float, paint the waterline strip and away we go... :woo_hoo:
[attachment=0]Not much left to do now 28 June 13.JPG[/attachment]
So, all in all, a fairly short list. Will do more over the weekend and see how close we are by the end of it. :big_grin:

G'day Tiny69, yeah, I have tried some new things in an attempt to learn some techniques for when I make a much bigger model I want to build. I want to build it closer to the real thing. I will be building the hull completely from steel and wanted to see how easy it is to work. The mild steel is fine, but the Stainless Steel is stiffer at the same thickness, harder to work and just a pain in general. The glues I have been using have been very good and am happy to recommend people trying them. There is an expansion issue with the glue and it will make a mess if you aren't careful, but it is impervious to water and for boat/ships, that's a good thing. :thumbs_up_1:

Now, I have been a busy boy today. Been sticking things onto the hull and superstructure. So here are the pics. As can be seen, the bits from the previous post were added along with the handrails on the side of the wheelhouse.
[attachment=5]Portside view 26 June 13.JPG[/attachment] and a closer view[attachment=4]View of the fittings 26 June 13.JPG[/attachment]
Have been dreading making up the ladders, but made a simple jig that held the treads at the right spacing and then soldered them all together. Seemed to work well and only took about 30 minutes to make up the 4 ladders.
[attachment=3]4 Ladders with template.JPG[/attachment]
So now that the ladders are made, gotta put ém on, so after putting on door handles, I finally put on the ladders, the rope buffer on the bow and the "rope" on the spools on the upper deck.
[attachment=2]Port side view 26 June 13 (2).JPG[/attachment]
I decided to put on the ropes around the Samson Post to finish off the Deck area of the Bow. The only thing left to do will be to finish off the waterline strip when the ship is ready for a swim.
[attachment=1]Bow complete except for waterline stripe.JPG[/attachment]
So now we come to the end of the days fun and I also soldered the supports for the mast, to the mast. I have the last pic taken to show where I am at now. Surprisingly little left to do, but most of the work will be around the top of the wheelhouse now. [attachment=0]Last pic of port side 26 June 13.JPG[/attachment] Still have to make the main tow hook, have a couple of pieces of block brass and will see about "carving" out the hook soon.

Some interesting and unusal construction techniques used to build your tug. Great to see someone trying something different.

The next few photo's will bring us up to date, so far the last 6 posts were all representing 15 months. Had delayed posting as I didn't know if the construction method would work and didn't know what other problems would be encountered whilst scrounging parts where I could. Enough of the tears, lets get up to date. :big_grin:
This pic shows the dusty deck with the foredeck dusted off and the winch finally in, the bell beam and brass support fitted, the brass mast fitted and the mast supports attached ready to be soldered together.
[attachment=3]Deck view 24 june 13.JPG[/attachment]
Here the handrails are on and the winch and anchors are fixed in position. The walkway supports are in and the bell is visible on it's beam. When the keel is on it's proper angle, the beam is much closer to level.
[attachment=2]Foredeck 24 june 13.JPG[/attachment]
Here the capstan and deck hatches are fitted. The capstan was carved from a piece of broom handle as were the deck hatches.
[attachment=1]Deck hatches and capstan fitted to stern.JPG[/attachment]
Here are the deck fittings minus the capstan that took a whole day to make, amazing how long it takes to make so little!!!!
[attachment=0]Deck fittings.JPG[/attachment]
Plenty more to go, so as I go from here on, the more I will post. Look forward to a southern hemisphere late spring launch...