Calling all IJN seaplane tender Notoro (能登呂) fans

[Milan Kuliffay]

Greetings to all the boat modellers on this forum.
May I ask for your help. I am making a model of the IJN Notoro - a seaplane carrier from 1931, for which I am drawing my own etchings. As this is a ship that operated in this modification from 1924 to 1941, there are quite a few photos available. From the photographs I have, it is not clear how the parts marked on the attached photographs were designed.
If anyone has any documents that would clarify this matter for me and would be willing to share them, I would be most grateful.


Milan Kuliffay

[Dan K]

Sorry, Milan - I've looked, but I've got nothing that can help you.

[Milan Kuliffay]

Dan, thank you very much for your helpfulness and response.
I am currently working on the "hangar protection platform" in the rear. The port side conversion is clear to me from the photos. This is especially well proven by the photo from 5.9.1931, when there was an explosion of aviation gasoline on Notoro.

I am only guessing at the starboard side, but from the material available so far I would make it as it is in my attached drawings.
Hopefully this will somehow approximate reality.

[BRUCE BOYER]

Does anyone have a source for the operations and protocols of IJN seaplanes and their tenders?

[Dan K]

As far as their operations go, you need to review each of their TROMS (Tabulated Record of Movement), which can be found here:

http://www.combinedfleet.com/kaigun.htm Note that the auxiliary carriers are split out separately from the regular naval versions.

Can you be more specific about what you mean by protocols?

[Milan Kuliffay]

A bit of reflection on the design of the forward part of the hangar platform at the bow.
From these photos, it is clear that there was a vertical wall on the port side with a transition to the bow.

There was probably some construction on the starboard side as well, as evidenced by this photo.

And this is the part that is not quite clear to me, or rather, according to this photo, I have some doubts about it.

The best way to see this part is in this photo. In a graphics program I tried to show the probable contours of the forward part of the hangar platform.
Is this correct? Or does anyone have another interpretation?

And to add to the doubts, in these two photos it looks as if there are no vertical side walls with transitions to the bow in the forward section.

I know the design may have changed over time. But for the 1930-1934 period, even the http://www.combinedfleet.com/Notoro_t.htm site doesn't give any conversion.
From the photos which are mainly dated to 1931 it is not clear to me how it was actually designed there.

[Milan Kuliffay]

In addition to the Notoro, the Tsurumi was converted into a seaplane carrier in 1924. I assume the appearance of the two ships was very similar, and the only significant change I have found from these photos is that apparently the Tsurumi did not have a covered station on the foremast above the hangar platform. I have nothing to confirm this, it's just my guess. However, both of these photos still don't give me an answer regarding the design of the front of the hangar platform. But they do point to another detail, which is some sort of structure ( crane ) on the starboard side of the bow.

[Milan Kuliffay]

In my last post I apparently gave incorrect information regarding the identification of the ship.
According to the information from http://www.combinedfleet.com, I assumed that the ship in the picture below was the Tsurumi.

However, I came into possession of a 1979 publication, The Maru Special No.25, from which I learned that the conversion of the Notoro to a seaplane carrier was gradual.

In 1924 the structure to cover the hangar was only in front of the bridge. The aft section didn't get a similar design until about a year later.
Similarly, the command post was not built on the foremast above the covering structure until 1929 because of the limited view from the original bridge.

There is a photo in the publication of the starboard side of the ship, similar to what I have presented here, but from a slightly different angle, which confirms the vertical side walls on the forward part of the hangar structure with transitions to the bow of the ship.
However, the design of the starboard vertical wall is not entirely clear even from this information.

So I'll keep looking, although I suspect that the amount of new sources of information is gradually diminishing given the years of service and the categorization of the Notoro.

[Dan K]

I don't know ow much help this will be but , FWIW:

The Model Art volume on IJN Auxiliaries (April, 2015, v. #915) has a really nice build of Notoro, converted from the Tsurimi kit. My scanner is inoperative, but here is one example page via photo.

[Milan Kuliffay]

Dan thank you.

I have the mentioned publication. I drew information from it as well.
The model is nice, cleanly built, but "out of the box only", with no other extras.
I even have the kit from Five Star Model FS710163, which can certainly take the final impression of the model up a few levels.

However, after studying all the information I already have about the IJN Notoro, I have found that the real-life execution of the ship is a bit different after all. That's why I decided to make my own etchings that are closer to reality.
And that is why I started this thread, to share the information I have about this ship and also I hope that if anyone has more information about the IJN Notoro and is willing to share it, it will help possibly other people interested in this ship.

[ijnfleetadmiral]

Thanks for all the photos...I only had a couple pics of Notoro before this!

[Milan Kuliffay]

One question again. Wooden deck for seaplanes above the boat deck. The Pit-Road kit W62 / W210, the Five Star Model FS710163 supplemental set, and all the Notoro models I've seen so far have a raised wooden deck only in the middle of the hull, so as to cover the fittings and piping that were originally there when the Notoro served as an oil tanker.

The picture on the model box even has the wooden deck raised the full width of the deck.

But the proof that this was not the case is in some of the photos.
Only the port side of the ship is well documented.

However, I am not aware of similarly good shots of the starboard side of the ship.
But if we look at the design of the IJN Wakamiya - the direct predecessor of the Notoro, or the design of the IJN Kamoi, it is clear that the way it is done in the model was not the case in reality. It's hard to imagine how seaplanes would have been handled if the starboard side of the ship didn't have a wooden deck aligned with the side of the hull.

In this photo of the Notoro it is well seen that the two seaplanes positioned longitudinally on the deck of the ship are level with the sides of the hull, and by their wings casting a shadow on the side of the hull it is obvious the wings protrude beyond the outline of the ship, so their position relative to the deck must be closer to the starboard side of the ship.
And this would not be possible with a design like the port side of the ship.

The only photo I have that gives an idea of how it might have been there is this one.
From it, I conclude that the starboard wooden deck where the seaplanes were loaded/unloaded was raised up to the edge of the hull sides. This is evidenced by the figures of the sailors. In the area at the level of the masts / cranes the deck was apparently lowered as that is where the crane winches were located. Therefore, some sailors are lower in these locations.
Do you think this interpretation of mine is correct?

[Dan K]

See of this link to the KMM for Notoro helps at all. Some pics in that not seen before, particularly after some sort of accident.

http://jmapps.ne.jp/yamatomuseum/list.h ... t_count=50

[Milan Kuliffay]

Dan thank you very much for the link.
I didn't know about this site and found some very valuable photos there that I hadn't seen before.
And one that also gives an answer to my last question about the height of the wooden deck for seaplanes.
The photo is of Notoro with Hosho, and judging by the figures of the sailors on the starboard side of the ship, it's obvious that it's as I described in my last post.
So this is how I'm going to modify the draft etchings.

Thanks again.

[Milan Kuliffay]

I have one more question for the IJN boat experts.
Does anyone know what the device - a platform attached to the hull on the port side of the ship - was used for?
It is clearly visible in the photos from 1931, 1934 and 1938.

[Dan K]

I don't have a clue. I had a thought that it might be a hinged platform, but I couldn't imagine what it would be used for. Some kind of staging platform? Just guessing on all of it.

[Timmy C]

Maybe a platform for maintaining seaplanes while they're in the water so the wing tips don't touch the hull sides?

[Milan Kuliffay]

Dan, Timmy

Thank you for your responses.
If that platform was folding, it probably wasn't intended for the purpose Timmy describes. It would probably have been parallel to the waterline. But she rather follows the slope of the deck at the front of the ship.
I originally thought it was a hangar side cover which could be used in bad weather. But given that in all available photos it is in that position, not to mention the photos from 1938 when Notoro no longer had a covered hangar and that platform is there, I don't think that's likely.

[Landlubber Mike]

I'm wrapping up a few 1/700 builds, and decided that the Notoro would be my next. I have the Pit Road kit along with the FiveStar detail set, and had a question on the various decks/platorms on the ship: (1) bow, (2) stern, and the three middle decks - (3) original bottom deck from when it was an oiler, (4) the deck immediately above it, and then (5) the upper platforms). What's confusing is that the kit and the FiveStar set seem to envision different types of decks being used.

For the kit:

(1) bow - wood
(2) stern - linoleum
(3) original bottom deck from when it was an oiler - linoleum
(4) deck immediately above (3) - wood
(5) upper platforms - wood

For the FiveStar set:

(1) bow - metal
(2) stern - metal
(3) original bottom deck from when it was an oiler - wood
(4) deck immediately above (3) - wood
(5) upper platforms - unclear, could be wood or metal slats

I tried looking at other tankers, but I didn't find any compelling scheme that would apply to the Notoro. I feel pretty comfortable that (4) is wood. Looking at the colorized picture above, however, it seems that (1) and (2) are either wood or linoleum and (5) is likely wood. I understand that the Notoro gradually underwent improvements over the years, so it's quite possible that both Pit Road and FiveStar are correct depending on the year the ship is being modeled. I may just go with the Pit Road scheme and skip the FiveStar parts for (1) - (3).

Any thoughts on what the various decks and platforms should be? Thanks in advance!

[Milan Kuliffay]

I think the correct option is how you described it for the kit.