The Ship Model Forum

when i was a young fellow in the early 50's i lived in a little town called alert bay on a island in behind vancouver island. twice in a couple of years tribel class d.e's anchored in the bay. i think one was the hmcs haida they came to the dock in a small boat and took a bunch of us kids out for a tour,i was in heaven i thought she had to be the biggest "battleship"in the world.

I have now assembled my Eskimo. The box claims to represent her in 1941.
Whilst the end result certainly resembles a Tribal, I’m afraid am disappointed. For me the model does not actually capture the true look/character of one. I’ve been trying to put my finger on exactly what is wrong and come to the conclusion it is the sum of a number of things:

- The hull has too many portholes forward. Eskimo had her bow blown off it 1940 and was rebuilt with fewer portholes than the other British Tribals. (I hope Trumpeter does not plan to use the same hull for Australian or Canadian Tribal versions as they too had fewer portholes than the other British Tribals.).

- The forecastle deck is absolutely horizontal. Real Tribals had a graceful very slightly upward sweep towards the bow.

- The 4.7” turrets are too tall/square/ boxy. The top of the real ones sloped down to the sides and their front face was much more rounded at the corners. There was also a bit of turret face between each of the guns themselves.

- The bridge is out of proportion looking slightly too tall. It’s perhaps the most significant reason the model looks wrong.

- The one piece tripod foremast. The angle between the foremast proper and its supporting legs is much too small - the foremast therefore does not slope backwards dramatically enough and is perhaps the second major reason the model looks wrong; the supporting legs do not come together at the rear of the mast but instead come to a sort of horizontal bar; the mast and its supports are braced by solid triangular platforms rather than open struts; the yardarms are too short; the radar at the top of the mast is just a solid rectangular piece of plastic.

- There are no davits for the ship's boats

- The aft funnel is at the pre-war full height – in 1941 it was lower.

- The torpedo tube mounting which has a large central gap with a pair of torpedoes either side of it and a strange rectangular “coffin” on one side.

There are of course further minor details improve.

Cheers.

You can correct a few of these with etch. I have a spare set of J/K/N class etch and some of the old tribal etch by WEM. This will fix the davits and radar straight away. I had no idea about the portholes and I suspect not too many people do but couldn't some of them be filled without too much difficulty? The 4.7's, 4' and TT can be replaced by WEM resin parts - the TT by WEM has a gap in it too, not as dramatic but still a gap. The mast can be scratchbuilt from brass rod if you have a good scale drawing. Tripod mast's aren't that hard to do. I'm not sure what to do about the bridge or the hull upsweep - the funnel height though - how much was it reduced by and what does that work out in 1/700? I'm not sure but it can't be that much.
You're right, they should have done better but it's not a total disaster - I think it will build up into a nice enough model and to most people will look like a tribal. The painting instructions have the wrong colours but I have that sorted now. I've run out of white primer, so the build hasn't got very far, I'll make more of a judgement when I have assembled some more.

thanks
Mike

Hi,

I've recently recieved this kit from WEM and I remember a thread recently on another site suggesting a colour scheme for Eskimo which I think was :

Hull B55
Upperworks White
Deck MS2

Can anyone confirm this? Or indeed what the colours are on the scheme on the instructions (If it's accurate).

Thanks in advance

Stuart Wilson

The camou pattern is correct - there is a photo of her in Friedman's book on RN destroyers. The colours are as you said - MS2 decks, where it says light grey in the instructions it should be white and where it says dark grey it should be B55 (light blue). Some decks may be corticene though but I'm not sure which ones.

thanks
Mike

Still haven't got mine, but would it be possible to curve the foredeck by glueing it at the rear, and then putting a post behind the bow? The sides could then be filled and smoothed.

Undesirable work but would it cure the problem?

Dear Stuart,

The colours suggested in the kit are wrong as has been previously highlighted. The design of the painting scheme in the instructions is essentially correct, but note that A and probably B turrets and the front of the bridge were also “blue”.

If you are doing an out-of-the-box build, the kit depicts Eskimo as she emerged from her refit in September 1941 (see first attached photo). The white is “RN white”, a very slightly yellowish off-white, and the blue at that time was the very light “Western Approaches blue” (both these are available from wonderful White Ensign Models in their colourcoats range if you want to get them exactly right).

The suggestion of B55 was made in reference to a picture of Eskimo showing a much darker shade to the “blue” areas (see second attached photo). But this is for a much later time, 18 or more months later in 1943. By then there would have been a host of further modifications/additions in areas such as the light AA, radar, director, HF/DF and A/S fit which the kit does not provide.

Cheers.

Looking at my example, I'd say that would be the simplest way to sort the issue. I'd also go as far as filling in the port holes and re doing - they're a bit wonky on one side.

I would also recomend replacing the 4.7 and 4" mountings. The torpedo tubes are, as already stated, pretty bad. If you've a spare set from the Tamiya E-Class, use that instead.

Definately a could be better, but nothing a bit of patience and elbow grease couldn't fix.

BTW, would Matabele have been in AP507B in late 1940 after her 4" was fitted? There's a pic of her in "Afridi to Nizam" that seems to indicate that, but some advice would be helpful!

Cheers,

Mike.

Its just amazing that nowadays with todays technology, you would think that Trumpeter would produce top notch kits. Its like they went back about 30 years with their small parts, ie, torpedo tubes, main guns, secondaries and so on. It is like a rush job IMO.


Bob Pink.

Thanks for all the replies, I've got some b55 but I might splash out on that light blue next time I order from WEM.

Stuart Wilson

Finally got mine: first impressions are that we've been concentrating on the disappointments rather than on what is a rather nicely tooled little model destroyer. The smaller weapons are the best I've seen, the Carley Floats come with cross backing structure, the pom-pom is rather neat for an injection moulding. The deck furniture is neatly moulded with decent draw angles - more like boxes than truncated pyramids. I remain totally unmoved at having to shorten the funnel, and am ready to replace the tubes, curve up the foredeck and fill a few portholes. Just what to do with the bridge or the main guns will depend upon comparing them with the WEM Cossack, but a look back at the Matchbox Kelly shows how far we have come.

I reserve the right to change my mind following later work.

at last someone thinking the same as me!

thanks
Mike

OK, first session over, if a little short. This may not be the most accurate British destroyer kit yet, but it is the finest tooled, with pleasantly fine walls. Fit, so far, is excellent.

I tried putting a post near the bow to arc the deck, but this was perhaps a mistake as I spent far to much time trying to shorten it by filing and then regluing, and waiting for it to dry. Perhaps it might be better to glue some microstrip across, resting on the ledge the deck rests on, and raising it that way.

The twin 4in is awful, and was binned along with the torpedo tubes. However, the spare 4.7 can be filed down to a representative shape. I could have used WEM parts, but didn't have any. I reshaped each of the remaining 4.7in turrets by flattening the top, then re-angling it from the sides. The front corners were rounded, leaving the top third sharp to represent the lookout position (or whatever the correct word is). The end result was distinctly superior, for very little work. Again, there are WEM parts, but I have the original WEM Cossack, and the turrets are not as good as reworked kit ones.

The bridge has been set aside to be reduced in height when dry - a lttle off the top and a little more off the bottom.

Graham
Niko does replacements for both twin 4" and 4.7" which are nice, the latter are a little off but better than anything else I have seen

Mike

_________________
Starling Models

http://www.starling-models.co.uk

I'll be starting mine soon. I was delayed by the lack of white primer and some new brushes. I have them now, so I'll make a start when I've finished the Kaiyo. I think I have some WEM torpedo tubes and twin 4', I also have some old Cossack etch from WEM - so that will replace the searchlight platform. I have some spare WEM J/K/N class etch with the correct radar for the mast and railings etc, so i should be ok for bits. I'm not going to be doing any butchery as I still think it will look like a tribal, even if a few things a slightly out. Your right though - my first thoughts were - this looks like a nice neat kit with some nicely moulded parts. Just remember though - the AA rangefinder is wrong - after the refit she had an enclosed AA rangefinder/director (a bit like a hacs but not a hacs) with yagi ariels on top.
thanks
Mike

I thought I had some spare twin 4in from the Matchbox Ariadnes, intended for a Petard, but they seem to have been lost - possibly not entirely a bad thing, of course - so will be buying either WEM or Niko, probably WEM. I didn't mean to cast doubt on WEM's 4.7s, as I don't know that the current ones on sale are the same as in their original Cossack.

I'd missed the comment about the searchlight platform needing replacement, and although remembering the comment about AA control I have not (yet) looked for anything better.

I received my HMS Cossack from Loose Cannon today, and what a nice kit it is. It does have a shortened funnel unlike the Trumpeter kit. I'll give a better review of it when I get back from Vegas next weekend.



Bob Pink.

For those building the Trumpeter Eskimo...

http://picasaweb.google.com/dickfalmouth/Tribal#

Cheers

How bad is the difference between model and accurate bridge height? Looks like a trip to WEM for 4.7 inch guns and torpedo tubes - what torpedo tubes from WEM do I need, and is it worth getting any other bits from their such as AA guns, radar lanterns etc, and if so, what do I need for HMS Zulu?

It has since been said that the bridge is the right height - presumably on Steel Navy?

What else you buy from WEM depends upon your modelling abilities - as I've said just taking a file to the kit turrets is cheaper. They do have a revised Cossack fret which goes beyond my current abilities but may be worth considering. The best bet is simply to go through their catalogue on-line and cherry-pick.