The Ship Model Forum

Well, as an active board member, I have no doubt mentioned my What-if diorama of Truk Lagoon. Now, with the help of some members, I have come up with an entire explanation:

Well, it all starts in WW1, when the Allied Powers start to see the full potential of naval aviation. During this time period, they come up with the ships actually designed in the inter-war years: the Langley, Lexington class, Ranger, Wasp and Yorktown/Enterprise are commissioned, with Hornet coming to a late start and the keel being laid. The 12 of Essex class are produced in the early 20's, the 6 Midways are made in the late 20's/early 30's, and the 5 Forrestals in the late 30's. With war once again looming with the invasion of China in the 30's by Japan, the Nimitz is designed just as the first Forrestals are coming off the slipways. In the early 30's, all pre-Essex carriers are converted into more useful ships. The Lexingtons however, would remain in the mothball fleet. Langley, Ranger, and Wasp would all be stripped down of their aviation maintenance facilities, and instead be used as aircraft ferries. The Yorktown/Enterprise would become Amiphibious transports, and the Hornet an oversized LSD. Also, in the inter-war years, 6 Essex class carriers would be scrapped.

By the time of Pearl Harbor, the USN will have 6 Essex, 6 Midways, 5 Forrestals, 2 Nimitz (2 more on the way), and 1 Ford (3 more on the way). The Japanese, well, basically be around the Kaga, 2 Hiryu, 3 Akagi, 4 Taiho, and 4 Shinano class vessels.I know, I know, at Pearl Harbor, BB row would become CV row. The answer is that the CVs would be 4 Essex, 1 Midway, and 1 Forrestal class vessels would be severly damaged. Only the Midway/Forrestal would be salvaged. The 2 other Midways, 2 other Forrestals, Nimitz and Ford would be off sending aircraft to the different Pacific Outposts. However, with most of these under attack, they get redirected to Midway and Wake Island. At a battle of Wake, a Midway and Forrestal would fight, with the Midway being sunk. Wake/Midway would get more shipments of aircraft as the beginning of the war progresses. The Battle of Midway would become the Battle of Wake, where 2 Forrestal, the Nimitz and Ford class would fight first, and reinforcements of 2 Midways and some 3 Essex would come. Then, with the brunt of the IJN off at Wake, the US goes to capture Guadalcanal, which, without naval support, falls easily. In 1944, after a year of building up the Navy, the US starts the Island hopping campaign. With the original number of 4 Essexs, 5 Midways, 3 Forrestals, 3 Nimitz, and 4 Fords, the Battle of the Philippine Sea, and Leyte Gulf are just outstandingly easy. The US takes another break for the next year, keeping the carrier fleet around Leyte. Also, with a massive fleet, funding for atomic research ends. With the severe morale blows, Japan wants a victory. They go for an old base: Guadalcanal.

The Japanese strike in early 1946. 4 different task forces sortie out from Japan. They take the lightly defended islands of Tarawa, Guam, and 2 forces go for Guadalcanal. All islands fall within the same 48 hours. Upon reports of the attack, the USN goes out into the defensive mode for 6 months, isolated in the Philippines. The navy forms a defensive half circle from China to Australia. With the victories, Japan decides to start their pre-Wake targets: Australia.

The Japanese land in Port Moresby, which is only moderately defended. They go on a Blitz, taking half of the continent in 2 weeks. Now, with the US gains some active allies; nearly all of the countires of South America. With the thought that Japan could take Australia, and keep the USN isolated, virtually the entire eastern side of the Pacific lacked any defense. Also, the shipsin the Philippines needed supplies. Ships could be brought from the Atlantic, but that means shrinking convoys, and leaving them vulnerable against a vast U-Boat fleet - a no no for Britain if it were to survive. After some political battles, the US gets the countries of South America to send convoys under a USN sub escort to the Philippines going south of Australia. This new fleet nearly triples the size of the Allied merchant navy, and doubles the size of the escort force.

With supplies going to the USN in the Philippines, they can go on the offensive. Still under the effects of the island hopping campaign, Truk Laggon and Rabaul are weak and easy targets. If the USN was to take back Australia, and other lost territory, they needed staging points. They will take Truk Lagoon first, build it into an operational base, then move on to Rabaul, where they would repeat the process until the US was at the doorstep of Australia: Guadalcanal.

Third Fleet, under Halsey's command, would go out in 1947, based around the CVs. Along with them, Seventh Fleet: the Amphibious Task Force. They land in Truk, and after 3 weeks of fighting, take the base. After another few months, the fleets go for Rabaul. This too falls easily. Now, in early 1948, the US begins the strike against Guadalcanal. After a month of hard fighting, it falls. This time, instead of waiting, the fleet replenishes from the South American convoys, and head for Port Moresby. The entire landing force goes ahead and takes the port. They drive straight through the undersupplied IJA, cutting them in half. Another Landing Force, made up of a mix of the US Army, USMC and South American units land in Melbourne, and and take that city back. From there, they launch their own Blitz, meeting up with the first landing force in 3 weeks. With the huge force now gathered, the Allies go on the offensive, and start going off in 2 detchments: each going on their own march to the sea. They retake Australia in another month.

Now, the US defensive border goes from Wake, South to Australia, and back up to China. To close the gap in the middle, the US has to take Guam and Tarawa. It was difficult enough to get the first victories, but with an even more determined enemy, the US just bypasses the islands, going straight for Iwo Jima. That islands falls fairly quickly, because a third of the Japanese ground forces have been lost in Australia, or are in Guam and Tarawa. Another third is stuck in China. The same goes for Okinawa. Now, with two thirds of their fighting force gone, Japan is left to fend for themselves. Now, with the atomic research down the drain, X-Day will become a reality...with the war ending about 11 months later.

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Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Here is the scenario in Europe; it took a lot of work:
I have the perfect starting point: Dunkirk. The British are not able to mobilize a large enough recovery fleet to get back the better part of Expeditionary Force. Only a third make it back to England. Now, England has lost experienced fighters, and worst, a massive amount of qualified airmen are stranded as POWs, just as the Battle of Britain begins. The British lose without much of a fight. With the knowledge that Britain stands little chance of survival, civilians are all evacuated to the countryside, and the military men are sent to the eastern coast, where they are setting up a decoy coastal battery system. Guns start sprouting up along possible invasion beaches, and leaving the Germans stunned, putting off operation Sea Lion, at least long enough for a large population of Britain to be sent to Canada. When the invasion finally happens, only a handful of civilians and the military remain on the island. Britain falls with a hard fight, but it still does fall. None of the British Military made it to Canada, other than RN units, including the survivors of the Bismark Hunt, and those in the Far East, which go to Australia. In the meantime, on the Eastern Front, it is like WWI all over again. The Germans and Russians are in a stalemate, with neither side having the resources to begin an all-out attack.

Now, in late 1941, the Americans come into play. But, nearly the entire Atlantic is under German control. The US shifts a vast number ships to the Pacific, leaving submarines, tenders, and escorts from destroyers down. These would go out in task groups, with tenders as the flagships. USN Subs would hunt down the U-boat tenders and surface ships, leaving U-Boats to starve and be scuttled or captured. With less U-Boats, and a very small surface fleet, the Germans could barely keep the Atlantic. By the time the Germans can come out with newer U-Boats, the USN/RCN is already sending out the surface fleet, made up of 5 CVs, Nearly all of the RN BBs, and some 30 cruisers. These go out and destroy ports, while subs and CV aircraft run through the English Channel, starving the German stronghold of occupied Britain.

With the German Navy under control, the Allies set out from The East Coast, and head for Britain. Without a steady stream of supplies and a low morale, the island falls quickly. Now, this is where the war gets moving. With England back in Allied territory, and convoys once again sailing to Russia, the stalemate there ends. Russia goes on the offensive, pushing through German lines, and into Germany within 2 months. Germany sends the units in West Europe east to counter the Russian threat, with the thoughts that the US would wait to invade until summer. This is where the Strategic Bombing campaign comes in. B-17s, B-24s, and B-29s manned by US Airmen fly from Russian and Chinese Airfields over the Eastern Front, crippling German supply lines. As the war in the East heats up in 1947, the US, British Commonwealth, and South Americans head to Normandy and the Paix de Calais. These units quickly spearhead their way into Germany, meeting the only real defense on the doorsteop of Berlin. Here, US commandos go in, and take Hitler hostage, forcing the loyal German commanders to surrender in 1948.


Anyone out there that wants to help me? I have enlisted the help of some people, but I still await their replies.

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Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Question, would the US keep British forces in the Med / North Africa in the game. If German / Italian forces kick Commonwealth Forces out of North Africa, suez canal falls, access to the Middle Eastern oil fields, this could alter the balance big time, or does taking advantage of this just overstretch Germany with her other commitments.

Also with the Med an axis lake, the Italian fleet could be thrown into the Atlantic?

just a couple of thoughts.

Si

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Simon Heathwood

Well, all of that does happen, except for the whole oil thing. Yes, all that oil does do something. It sits in North Africa. German shipbuilding capacity, even with the captured British Isles, is still the same because all of the shipbuilders have been brought to England.

Also, the Italian Fleet would be brought to the Indian Ocean, to prevent a breakout by the USN in the Pacific to the Atlantic.

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

You know what, forget that Simon. I have a better idea...

After the fall of France is when the battle of North Africa heats up. The French there, including the Jean Bart, defy their government and join the Allies. They leave port unprepared, and head for the Southern Atlantic, where they will be safer from U-Boats. From there, they would go on to Brazil. After Political battles, Brazil enters the war soon after the US. The French Fleet would then go to the US after Brazil, where the ships will get an overhaul, featuring triple 16 inch guns.

Meanwhile, the war in North Africa rages. After Britain falls, the troops in N. Africa follow the French example, fleeing to Brazil in a Dunkirk-style fashion. The Allied navy vessels in the Northern Med. Sea all head for the ports of North Africa, where they pick up the troops, refuel/resupply and other than a handful of ships, unarm themselves and take on the troops. BBs, Subs, DDs, and any ocean-worthy vessel that can accomodate troops does so. The only exception are the carriers, which provide aircover for the convoy heading to Brazil. This force immediately gets to work. Those who kept their weapons are brought onto Transports. They head just a little up north...to French Giuana. They land there, taking the colony for the Allies. North Africa does fall, but forces there are evacuated first.

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Good scenario,

remember the British Army in North Africa was less than 50,000 strong at this point, and mainly in Egypt, so evacution with fleet in Alexandria would be practical. (The build up didn't really start until 1941, My father was serving in the Buffs (The East Kent regiment) at the time and transfered to the Royal Engineers just in time to miss being sent to North Africa in late '41)

I would keep as many ships combat ready as possible, The Italian fleet would be a threat, not just the heavy ships, submarines & MTB's also their air force was capable of giving a good account of itself.

Admiral Cunningham had quite a fleet at his disposal, especially if he called the ships from Gibralter & malta to Alexandria for the pick up.

Thing is would he order the suez canal to be blocked, It could be a good option, although he probably wouldn't have spare tonnage to use as block ships.

a few more thoughts

Si

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Simon Heathwood

Well, to handle the canal issue, I have an idea...

It is true that the canal would want to be blocked. But it will be left to the Germans; at least until after the DKM is wiped off the Atlantic. Remember those USN subs I mentioned? I would send 1 or two task forces of subs to the Indian Ocean after duty in the Atlantic. They would stay in the Indian Ocean, hunting down ships that pass the canal, and the Italian Fleet stationed there.

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Good thought, especially if the allies hang on to Ceylon, with the British Army in India & the Indian Army they should manage that.

Provided they manage to keep the japanese out of India, with no support or resupply from the UK. But then it would be in the American interest to keep the British army fighting in Malaysia / Burma in order to tie down Japanese resources.

As much of the required raw materials are available in the area, South Africa might be a good place to transfer some industry to, resupply to certain unoccupied parts of the empire would be less hazzardous than from Canada.

just some further thoughts.

Si

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Simon Heathwood

You've really not given this much thought have you?
Put this in that us Brits quit and the rest makes no sense.

"we shall fight them on the beaches....."

Rob

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IPMS Fine Waterline Special Interest Group

The Coastal Batteries were, after all, only fakes. Also, the British were woefully supplied and undermanned, leaving much of their equipment and qualified airmen at Dunkirk.

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Well, to ease the burden of switching pages between threads (since they go together), I've copied my parts of the Essex/Nimitz thread:
I must agree with you [Sauragnmon] - the Nimitz would have been a force all it's own. The Midways, the supercarrier of thier age, could hold some 115 WWII Aircraft. Imagine, a carrier that makes the Midway look like an Independence. Also, if the war didn't end with the atomic bomb, and before the planned invasion of Japan, the Nimitz class, carrying sea-capable Mustangs, Mitchells, or Invaders. Along with the numerous Essex, Independence, and Jeep Carriers, the force could have done the same as the atom bomb, yet avoid the coming nuclear threats.

The USN would want sea-capable Mustangs for the greater range to accompany the B-25s. The Bearcat had an extremely limited range for it's size, and the corsair and hellcat didn't have the range to do that either. As a side note, the USS Shangri La successfully tested a carrier-capable P-51D on 15 November 1944, with the addition of a tail hook. It was able to take off without assistance from a catapault.

I was thinking armament would be 1944ish, just before the kamikaze threat. I completely understand the whole shipbuilding capacity issue here, and agree that this is highly inpractical. The pros and cons of having this huge machine in battle. Actually I have an idea... Think of the morale affect this would have, or the aircraft capacity and types. I personally, would like to have the Mustang, Mitchell, Lightning, Avenger, and Helldiver or Dauntless on board. Huge potential, and with enough of some of these aircraft, they could cut short the pcoming kamikaze threat.

The solution to protecting the ship lies in numerous shipyards - like the Philly Navy Yard. I was watching a documentary that stated that their were hundreds of Wickes and Clemson class 4 Piper destroyers. The 4 inch gun armament - even though obsolete, a good surface action gun against the thin armor of U-Boat. Also, if I remember, these had tons of torpedoes and depth charges. Lastly, because this was a flush decker, there was enough space to put some K-guns, Hedgehogs, or Mousetraps.

I just had another thought that might actually have helped win the war - the Nimitz class as the world's first Assault Carrier. With that huge deck, as well as hanger, and all of those compartments in the actual design that had no use back then, why not turn this into a paratrooper ship? It could carry the C-47 or C-46, but navalized with the folding wings and tailhook of course. The hanger could possibly house 40 something aircraft and all of the required maintenance equipment. That would sum up to carry some 1,000+ Marines. A squadron of Mustangs/Apaches could take care of the Escort/CAP issue, and they wouldn't even be needed if these carriers worked in Amphibious battle groups with a normal Essex along side. These troops could have been used to knock out those bunkers and other high security targets in the pre-invasion bombardment phase of an Amphib invasion, like the use of paratroopers in D-Day. Gliders probably would not have been an option, considering the amount of space needed to get them into the air. (Unless..........)

If I may, what if I added the Forestals into the mix. With the same WWII technology though. These ships could end up working alongside the pretty obsolete Essex class. (I'm not including Independence because they were made as emergency carriers weren't they?).The Long Island, Langley, Ranger, Wasp, Yorktowns and Lexingtons would have been in mothballs or second-line duties if these were made.

If the Nimitz, Midway, and Forestal classes were made, I'm pretty sure the war would have been won sooner. But, back to the amphib idea. Assuming the Essexs would be on more minor carrier duties, [i]They[i] probably would have been the guinea pigs to this. I was thinking, to accomodate gliders, one or two of them would be fitted with a HUGE catapault. Maybe 3/5s of the deck long. The Essex would have probably been able to accomodate enough Marines to hit an airfield behind enemy lines (I'm actually thinking some 500 something men). The Aviation Support Crew would have been heavily reduced to maybe about 100 something men by then. This is assuming the crew number stayed around the same. Armament I'm guessing would require some 400 men, and the rest of the 1,700 something crew would be in as the actual ship crew. Once they've delivered the men, the C-47s could act as transports, ferrying supplies to the Marines on the ground.

I know what one of you will say about the whole paratrooper idea: The Pacific islands were not ideal paratroop terrain with the dense forests and jungles. Well, my answer to that is that places like Guadalcanal, Peleiu, Iwo, Okinawa, the Philippines +, and all have one thing that was a major threat to be taken care of, and a main target on every mission: An Airfield. The wing of attack aircraft would have spent quite a lot of time knocking out all of the flak guns, considering that the Japanese weren't really known to have so many around on the ground, and barracks buildings. With guns and a pretty large number of men taken care of, 200+ Marines could have survived well if they dug in. The Japanese were after all, expecting a sea invasion. Gliders could have brought in some 37mm AT guns, Jeeps, Mortars, a group of some 30 Seabees, fortification supplies, and reinforcements. These all would have helped in the Invasion to come. An Paratrooper Carrier could have possibly, if at Leyte, left the Escort Carriers of the Taffys (which could have been the Enterprise, Hornet, Sara, Yorktown, or Lex if the Forestals, Midways, Essexs, and Nimitzs were on the scene with Halsey) to fight the Center Force coming in to attack. I am not forgetting the escort ship issue though. I still think the Atlantas, Brooklyns, Clevelands, Baltimores, Fletchers, Bensons, and upcoming DD numbers should be the same, considering the massive airwing to stop incoming threats. Another thought: If the Japanese wanted to crush the USN at the Philippine Sea, they would have sent practically every aircraft that could be launched to attack, and with more aircraft Japanese shot down, that would mean less Kamikaze aircraft, less casualties, and the war would end a month even sooner.

A lot, I know, but this Amphibous idea could have saved a lot of everything. Some idea though.

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Continued:

The Gerald Ford would have been at the heart of the combat battlegroups. All of the Ford, Nimitz, and maybe 4 Essex class ships would have been running around with Halsey and his command. The rest of the Essex class would have to be the Amphib ops and other ideas I will come up with.

Here is my take on what the deck of a paratroop Essex class would look like:

The long line running from the bow to the island is my HUGE catapault to assist in glider take offs. The tow plane (C-47 or C-46) would be attached to the catapault, and the glider attached right behind it. The Elevator in the rear would be enlarged, as well as the elevator on the port side. But, now that I think about it, the Essex is too small. I'll see if a Midway would suffice then.

Okay, here is the Midway deck:

The Same things are shown here as in the Essex deck plan: enlarged catapault, enlarged elevator are in gray. This I think is more fitting due to the fact that the deck is large enough so that there is room for the gliders to get ready.

And before I forget, thanks to Cadman for the picture of the deck from the LCP Midway review!!!!!

My scrapped Hornet has given me an idea. Another Amphibious carrier I'm thinking about. Except, with a Yorktown. My Idea is, that if the Essexs and beyond were built in the 20s and 30s, the Yorktowns would be built into aircraft ferries or some other specialty ship. My idea is that the Enterprise and Yorktown would become USS Enterprise CVPA-1 and USS Yorktown CVPA-2 (Aircraft Carrier - Amphibious Transport - 1/2). They would hold 20 LCVP/LCPs and 12 LCM mk 6s each. The flight deck would be cut up so that it is copmletely flat on the port and starboard sides. The catwalks removed would make room for the machinery involved to lower the landing craft from the deck. The Hanger Deck would be completely sealed, open space would be made into maybe 3 armored compartments where the Marines would have their bunks. As for AA defense, the entire middle section of the flight deck would be free, and the guns that were once on the catwalks would be placed on platforms there. Maybe there would be room for two 5 inch twin mounts.

As for the Hornet, I had another idea. I would break it up like it was being scrapped, but in the mid and stern sections only. It would go down until the waterline. I would also eliminate the hanger deck and lengthen the hull by about 100 feet. Pumps and airtanks would be fitted too. The doors on the stern would be clamshells. (LST Type doors) This is basically an LSD on steriods. The well deck could hold SSSSOOOOOO much. I can't even say how many LVTs would fit, maybe an LST, 2 LCIs, etc... If this was built on the Wasp or Ranger Early in their service careers, they could be the mothership for 110' Subchasers, PT Boats, etc... If used at loaded with SCs in a carrier battlegroup, destroyers could focus on air attacks. Endless possibilities, especially when you think of the different varieties of craft these could carry.

But, now, I'll take you on a tour of my ideas. At the start of the war, carriers would number: 8 Essex, 4 Midway, 4 Forrestal, 4 Nimitz, 2 Fords (2 on the ways) The original number of Essexs (24), would have been cut to 16 due to the end of WWI. Now, 4 Essex and 1 Forrestal have been sunk/damaged beyond repair at Pearl, and 3 Essex scrapped in the interwar years. The Yorktowns, though older, have a more important role now than they would have as Aircraft ferries - the fate of the Ranger and Wasp. I would be referring to my previous post here. The Enterprise and Yorktown as Amphibious Attack Transports, with two units of the Brodie system and 8 Piper scout aircraft a piece (APA-Ls). Also to undergo this conversion is an Essex class. The Hornet would undergo conversion during the earliest phase of her construction: The LSD(L) design, also stated above. A Midway would become the paratroop carrier - stated above. The Langley, Ranger and Wasp would become Auxilaries. Langley as a target ship, and the Ranger and Wasp as Aircraft ferries. The Ferries would have all combat aviation facilities removed, and replaced with food ration containers. I'll explain the design in another post. The Essex class ships would become different types, as seen in their later careers. Maybe 2 CVS (Avengers and Mustangs) types, a scout carrier (Ship-based Kingfishers, Seahawks... and 2 fighter squadrons) and a full-time B-25 carrier (20 B-25 strafers, 1 fighter squadron).

Now, onto the escort issue. The large number of large ships requires some protection right? I say that the 8 Farraguts would be converted to PT Tenders. These would be the specialized torpedo and Sub-hunting types though. 16 depth charges a piece, plus 16+ Mousetrap racks on the Higgins 78 types. the Elco 80s would be the torpedo men. these could get up cloe and personal with any Japanese ship and unload their 4 torpedoes, and possibly serve as early warning scouts nearer to the fleet. Also, if the Somers class vessels were to have the AA equipment on the top of the deck removed and replaced by a catapault, these could have served better at scouting destroyers than the Fletchers. These could take the place of the aircraft on the cruisers and battleships, again, leaving more room for AA weapons. As another thought on the escorts, the number of Battleships should have been reduced. 2 North Carolinas, 2 South Dakotas, and 2 Iowas. The Alaskas should not have been built. Cruisers would number the same amount as the actual number, except with 9 more Clevelands, and 2 more Baltimores. Destroyers would be the same too. With more Aircraft flying off the decks, there would be less of a need for the huge escorts.

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Continued:

Here is my Battleplan: My guess is that the carriers would be split evenly between the two Oceans, but I would have a Ford and Nimitz in the Atlantic moved to the Pacific. This would, in the process of going out to sea, be the ships to replace Hornet at the Doolittle raid, with maybe B-25s numbering some 30 a piece. To escort these behemoths, a Nimitz, 2 Midways, and 2 Essexs, two of my PT Tenders, as well as the normal escorts. The rest of the carriers would be on their way to defend the troops at Wake, add onto the aircraft at Midway Island (Ranger and Wasp), and the rest on patrol everywhere else. In the meantime, I would deploy an Essex or two, as well as the 4 surviving old BBs around Pearl Harbor. During the time around Doolittle Raid, I would have the 5 of the Bogue CVEs off the West Coast, and the rest of them on patrol in the convoys. To aid the under-forced CVEs in the Pacific, I would add that some small seaplane tenders be added into the mix. Those conversions I mentioned earlier to the Essexs would be around 1943ish. I just remembered, the Lexingtons!!! I'd have these picketed near the northeast coast of Australia, based at Port Moresby. For the actual actions, my strategy would be that the for every major sized carrier (Forrestal+), there would be an Essex/Midway/Lexington Companion.

Now, onto the auxilary forces. To guard the vessels such as AOs, APAs, Aircraft ferries... I would assign the Pensacola, and Omaha class ships and destroyers. These, being Cruisers, are average at everything. The 8/6 inchers for surface targets, 5 inchers for AA, plus all of the small caliber weapons. And because these are the slow-pokes of the navy, the destroyers could be the 4-stackers. These would have torpedoes, depth charges, and medium caliber AA guns. The Amphibious Forces. That is a complicated one. The 3 ships I had mentioned, the ex-Yorktown CVs, and the more conventional LSTs, LCIs, etc. would have to be in a single Task Group. The Escorts could be made up of the same things as in the Carrier Fleet, except instead of Heavy Cruisers, the Brooklyn class Light Cruisers. Later in the war, the destroyers would be reduced, being replaced by Buckley and Butler class DEs.

Well, I just came up with an idea...again. This involves more of the other vessels in the fleet, like the Battleships and Cruisers and their secondary armaments... With bigger carriers on the move, the Escorts need to keep up and have more of a bang for their buck right? Starting in the early 30s, the (my fantasy) Navy will begin development of the automatic 6 inch guns, Like on the Worchesters. My idea is that ships Cruisers and Battleships post- 1939 be armed with these jaw droppers. Atlantas would recieve 5 mounts - 3 fore, 2 aft, Clevelands - 2 port/starboard, 2 fore/aft, Baltimores - same as Clevelands, Post-Dreadnaut BBs recieve 3 port/starboard in a Nelson style arrangement. Other than the Clevelands/Baltimores - which have a lot of free room where the 5 inch mounts are, the Atlantas have most of their guns on the centerline, just above each other. This is because in the Worchesters, there was little room due to the massive storerooms needed to house enough ammo for the huge automatic 6 inch guns. Same goes for the BBs.
For the Destroyers, it would be mix of armaments. On vessels from the Sims to Benson classes: 2 Single 6 inch autos would always be on the main deck both fore and aft. Above each of them, a half shield 5 inch gunhouse. For the Fletchers, the same deal, except where No. 3 mount and where the torpedoes were, a line of three 3 inch gunmounts. These would be the close in weapons for surface targets and frag AA munitions. I've always wondered why they were kept on the 3 oldest BBs, but not anywhere else, other than a handful of Subs. They are halfway between 40mm and 5 inch guns, having an exceptionally fast firing rate, and the ability to shred any aircraft in the sky. I would have 3 of these replace every two torpedo mounts. A powerful, neglected weapon.

Just to add to my fire... Back to the Auxilary fleet. It seems that the older generation of ships haas finally aged to the end of their careers by 1944, so vessels such as the 4 pipers and Omahas would be scrapped fight? WRONG!!!!! In my world anyway. The aft section would have all non-gun related equipment torn off and 3,5 and 6 inch guns placed wherever their is room (Omahas) This would make it the good All-purpose ship I could be, reducing the need for modern, specialized vessels to escort the slow convoys. Same for the 4 pipers, except not the 6 inch guns.

But there are others that are still just not needed anymore, like the Saratoga. This beast would have all but six 5 inch guns, 5 40mm Bofors quads/twins, and thirty 20mm Oerlikons removed. Those guns would be for training. I would have the Sara brought into the Great Lakes, and add to the training carriers Wolverine and Sable. This would add onto the training capacity, which can fill up the new carriers.

Wasp and Ranger, time for the official layout. They would have all repair, aircrew, and aviation fuel facilities removed, making way for maybe 10 more aircraft apiece. These carriers, being that they became ferries a long time ago, would also have very few armament, comprising of up to 30 20mm guns on the Wasp, and 20 on the Ranger, as well as a 3 inch gun both fore and aft on each vessel. These would travel with convoys, so there is really no need to have such an overly updated weapons fit.Oh, one more major piece: the island would just be ripped off. No need for the command center or all of those exravagent radar suites right?

I think it's about time I show off my alternate Yorktown class designs:
The USS Enterprise class APA(L)

The USS Hornet LSD(L) Thoughts anyone?

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

I seem to remember hearing the Hurricanes and Spitfires doing quite well, albeit eating into our reserves. Most of our aircrew that were shot down and survived did so over our soil, those they were quickly back in the air. On the other hand, shot down German aircrew were captured. Germany lost the Battle of Britain due to the attrition rate. Without superiority over either air or sea they could simply not put an invasion force to sea. There is equally no way the RN would sit on it's hands. Germany had very little in the way of ASW, the RN had a very effective submarine fleet. How much of the invasion fleet are the Germans able and prepared to lose?

Added to that the Blenheims and Hampdens destroying the German landing craft in port faster than they could replace them.

As to the thought of evacuating the civilian population? Even evacuating children to Canada was a very short-lived and minor activity which was quickly stopped after u-boats were attacking these ships. Strategically also a waste of resources when these ships could be bringing in troops from the colonies.

Therefore your whole premis quite frankly does not stack up.

Rob

_________________
IPMS Fine Waterline Special Interest Group

Why waste the ships on troops that are under seige? Also, if ships are transporting civilians, aren't there rules against putting torpedos into them? I know there were issues in the past, but wasn't there some Convention concerning this? Like the Geneva Convention?

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

You can have as many conventions and rules as you want, but you can only enforce them if you win. War isn't fair. It was the same convention that made it against the 'rules' to shoot a medic, of any army (which also required the medics to assist anyone regardless as well) but they still got shot (which is why in they started painting large red crosses on their helmets), at the end of the war the Japanese even made it their goal to shoot the medics first (which is why they stopped painting markings on the helmet and wearing the armband).

_________________
-Abram
ModelWarships Gallery Page
Joslin Models Facebook Page

I do recall thought hat the Japanese ignored the Geneva Convention. Also, A Medic is well cpable of shooting a gun. How about a ship without a waepon, and painted white?

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Firstly, to reinforce the troops already there.

Secondly, check your history. Plenty of civlian ships attacked during Ww2.

Rob

_________________
IPMS Fine Waterline Special Interest Group

Rob, did those ships have guns onboard? Even if they were for self-defense? Or armed Escorts?

New scernario for Europe. Still involves evac of civilians though. The mark is still Dunkirk. The losing team: The Allies. The British are still unable to get the better part of the men off the beaches. The British are cornered on their island, with only a fraction of the military they had a week ago. Hitler, knowing of the very possible danger this would bring, chooses to wait until Britain has fallen to attack Russia. Churchill sends out an SOS, calling every British ship, man, and as many supplies to haul themselves to Britain. Form North Africa, the Commonwealth armies are loading up onto ships, including the Free French forces that include the fleet anchored in Morocco. Convoys coming from the East will come from under The Cape of Good Hope are to dock at Liberia, then to Gibraltar and meet up with the forces coming from North Africa. A dummy convoy left from England in earl 1941. It comprised of some 67 empty, obsolete merchant ships. The crews are of volunteers, and are minimal for each ship. The only escorts for this convoy are the old battleships: HMS Ramillies, HMS Revenge, HMS Royal Sovereign, HMS Resolution, and HMS Warspite. They were to proceed to Boston, where they would undergo a refit. Every sea-capable ship in England was sent to clear a path from Gibraltar to safety in England, outside the range of the Luftwaffe. The convoy set out from Gibraltar, under heavy attack by the cocky German and Italian air forces. The attacks left the Ark Royal, Hood, KGV, Rodney, Dido, and 18 destroyers with bomb damage. The Queen Elizabeth, Norfolk, Fiji, an escort sloop, as well as 6 MTBs were sunk. Once out of range, the entire Royal Navy formed up in a US-style formation. Minelayers of all sizes trail the fleet, laying minefields to protect against U-Boats, those who weren't sent after the dummy convoy were sent to follow the real convoy heading for Britain. These would fall into the minefields, with a hefty %30 loss. The fleet makes it to Britain, but with the additional loss of the Exeter, Kenya, Nigeria, 7 destroyers, and 19 smaller vessels. Damages include the Illustrious, Barham, Suffolk, and 3 transports. Army personnel, now almost useless, are sent to flight school, where they learn the basics of flying, dogfighting, and ground attack. Aircraft start coming off the production lines, the most prominent being the Spitfire, Beaufighter, and Mosquito. During the delayed Battle of Britain, The cocky Luftwaffe bombers are sent in massive, loose formations in daylight. They sustain a surprising %75 loss rate after 3 runs. They switch to night attacks, and with radar-equipped ships off the coast, fighters, would achieve a still hefty %60 loss rate. The Germans try with fighters, but without better effect. Britain still wins the battle. All of the scraped metal from these aircraft are used to great effect by the British. Now, the U-Boats, without many targets, are sent to get rid of the RN around Britain, only to run into minefields, subchasers, aircraft, and as of early 1942, the USN. All of which are in concentrated forms now. U-Boats sustain a %47 loss rate. Still undaunted, Hitler orders the invasion of Britain. The invasion fleet sorties in late 1941, holding 27 transports, U-Boats, S-Boats/tenders, and the Bismarck, Tirpitz, Scharnhorst, and Gneisenau. British subs and MTBs attack with their own torpedoes, while aircraft take care of the U-Boats. When all is said and done, the Germans lose a transport, the Scharnhorst, 7 U-Boats, 12 S-Boats, and a tender. There are torpedoes and bombs in 8 more transports, the Tirpitz, the Gneisenau. 15 S-Boats, and 4 U-Boats are damaged. The Germans that do make it ashore run into the false shore batteries, and expecting a hail of fire, meet no resistance. They establish a beachhead, even under constant strafing by aircraft. When the transports leave to resupply, the RN aircraft carriers Ark Royal, Illustrious, Victorious, Formidable, Indomitable. They send 7 more transports to the bottom, as well as the Gneisenau, sent to escort them along with the Bismarck and Tirpitz. When more troops are being brought to Britain, the carriers, which are low on bombs, send out bombers to search out U-Boats with depth charges, and fighters to sink S-Boats. The Hood, KGV, Nelson, Rodney,Valiant, Malaya, Renown, POW, Repulse, Erebus, as well as heavy and light cruisers engage the convoy in a gun battle. The major escorts of the convoy are the Bismarck, Tirpitz, and cruisers Admiral Hipper, Prinz Eugen, a group of 8 destroyers, as well as 7 U-Boats, and 16 S-Boats/Tender. There are 15 transports. The U-Boats are engaged early on, with the loss of 4, and the other 3 damaged so badly they have to remain surfaced. The cruisers engage the destroyers and U-Boats, sinking 3 destroyers and the U-Boats, while damaging 4 more destroyers. They sustain the loss of the Danae to U-Boat torpedoes, and damage to the Dehli, Dragon, Belfast, and Erebus. with The battleships engage the enemy, concentrating and sinking the Bismarck and Tirpitz, with the loss of the Hood, Valiant, and Renown. The Admiral Hipper and Prinz Eugen sustain heavy damage before withdrawing, leaving the transports. The undamaged Nelson, Rodney, KGV, and POW go after these, along with the cruisers Edinburgh, Emerald, Jamaica, Norfolk, and US vessels Wichita, Tuscaloosa, Savannah, Vincennes, Augusta, Cincinnati, , battleships Texas, New York, Arkansas, New Mexico, Washington, and North Carolina. The USN ships were sent to Britain to aid in their defense, and have just arrived. The S-Boats that survived the onslaught go after the battleships, damaging the Repulse, nearly sinking her. They are all sunk after trying to go after the well-armed US vessels. The German infantry are left to starve under siege on the beaches of Britain, after only 4 transports are left from the original convoy of 15. After refueling in port, the USN destroyers run in during the middle of the night, sinking the transports with torpedoes while offloading supplies. The demoralized Germans on the beach try to call in air drops, the planes only to be shot down on the way to and from the drop zones by heavy naval and ground AA fire, as well as aircraft from the RAF/CAAC, and the FAA/USN (carrier Ranger came with the battle fleet.)

After these massive losses, a large internal resistance of the Gestapo, and top generals arrests Hitler and he dies in front of a firing squad. The top commanders work together to come up with a strategy. They drum up a last-ditch plan: use the Italian fleet, along with every possible U-Boat, to attack the fleet that are forming up in the British Channel. They assemble about 89 U-Boats, The battleships Vittorio, Roma, Vittorio Veneto, Giulio Cesare, Conte di Cavour, Andrea Doria, and Caio Duilio. Cruisers include the: Bari, Bolzano, Trieste, Trento, Zara, Fiume, Pola, Gorizia, Scipione Africano, Attilio Regolo, Attilo Regolo, Pompeo Magno, Alberto da Giussano, Alberico da Barbiano, Alberico da Barbiano, Giovanni dalle Bande Nere, Luigi Cadorna, Armando Diaz, Raimondo Montecuccoli, Muzio Attendolo, Emanuele Filiberto Duca d'Aosta, Eugenio di Savoia, Duca degli Abruzzi, and Giuseppe Garibaldi. The Germans also add on the Lützow, Admiral Scheer, Blücher, Schleswig-Holstein, Schlesien, Emden, Köln, Leipzig, Nürnberg, the newly repaired Admiral Hipper, and Prinz Eugen. The Italians also have a fleet of subs, corvettes, destroyers, and torpedo boats. Also At their disposal are the French vessels captured in France. This force is everything the Germans have left.

After hearing the news of Hitler's death, the world was ecstatic. Women began dancing in the streets, but the men were hard at work in Britain. With Hitler gone now, more experienced military leaders would run the show. With the men in the Pacific trapped in 1946, the build up of to liberate Europe can begin. Vessels, including aircraft carriers, are streaming in. Strangely though, aircraft production in the US has been slower than usual. A civil rights movement has begun, as the transportation issue in Philly has spread. Aircraft factories are hit hard. The large African-American work force are on strike, as the large white work force has needed transportation, and are leaving the blacks to walk to work, even if it is miles away.

The USN is sending 2 Essexes, 2 Midways, plus the new British designed Maltas to Britain. They, along with fleet that was just there, would spearhead their way to Europe. But, disaster strikes. Just as the Normandy invasion forces begin crossing the Channel, S-Boats fire torpedoes, damaging the escort craft that are supposed to be hunting the U-Boats. U-Boats and other Axis subs begin streaming into the Channel, from the north and south. From the North, German surface vessels, inder the cover of the Luftwaffe, will attack. The Italians will do the same from the South. The Italians, with more vessels, will slice into the convoy, and meet up with the Germans. The entire invasion force is split from their escorting carriers and battleships. The subs will sortie through the battle fleet, putting a single torpedo in as many vessels as they can. This is mostly against the carriers, so as to render their air cover as useless as possible. But they are instructed to not sink these ships, as when the Germans do win, they will have a grand navy. Aircraft rolling off decks at the angle the ships are listing. Battleships can't correctly aim their guns. Even with attempt to not sink any ships though, damage to some vessels, like the USS Franklin (Essex class), USS Monitor (Oregon City class), and HMS New Zealand (Malta class) are just too much. It threatens to capsize, so the signal is given to abandon ship. Destroyers pick up the many survivors, and go to work, towing back the damaged ships to Britain. %60 of the support fleet is gone, having to retire for repairs in Britain and the US. Only the Malta, Illustrious, Boxer (Essex class), and one of the 3 currently operational Habbakuk class carriers survive (USS Platts - my name of choice) The battleships KGV, Rodney, Nelson, Texas, and New York are left. Only nine cruisers are left. The losses are 1 light carrier (HMS Indomitable) 1 Battleship (HMS Queen Elizabeth) 2 Cruisers (HMAS Perth, USS Phoenix), and 7 Destroyers. The fleet is sent back, with the exception of the undamaged capital ships, and 31 destroyers. They are to trail the invasion fleet and take out U-Boat stalkers.The Invasion fleet is behind them, and is being turned around with the danger of U-Boats nearby. The Italian Fleet is busy setting up shop off Normandy, while The Germans go to the Paix de Caliais. AA ships are brought in, along with S-Boat and U-Boat tenders, which go on normal patrols to look for a prying enemy. More to come later, as I have to think more about it.

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines

Rob, did those ships have guns onboard? Even if they were for self-defense? Or armed Escorts?

New scernario for Europe. Still involves evac of civilians though. The mark is still Dunkirk. The losing team: The Allies. The British are still unable to get the better part of the men off the beaches. The British are cornered on their island, with only a fraction of the military they had a week ago. Hitler, knowing of the very possible danger this would bring, chooses to wait until Britain has fallen to attack Russia. Churchill sends out an SOS, calling every British ship, man, and as many supplies to haul themselves to Britain. Form North Africa, the Commonwealth armies are loading up onto ships, including the Free French forces that include the fleet anchored in Morocco. Convoys coming from the East will come from under The Cape of Good Hope are to dock at Liberia, then to Gibraltar and meet up with the forces coming from North Africa. A dummy convoy left from England in earl 1941. It comprised of some 67 empty, obsolete merchant ships. The crews are of volunteers, and are minimal for each ship. The only escorts for this convoy are the old battleships: HMS Ramillies, HMS Revenge, HMS Royal Sovereign, HMS Resolution, and HMS Warspite. They were to proceed to Boston, where they would undergo a refit. Every sea-capable ship in England was sent to clear a path from Gibraltar to safety in England, outside the range of the Luftwaffe. The convoy set out from Gibraltar, under heavy attack by the cocky German and Italian air forces. The attacks left the Ark Royal, Hood, KGV, Rodney, Dido, and 18 destroyers with bomb damage. The Queen Elizabeth, Norfolk, Fiji, an escort sloop, as well as 6 MTBs were sunk. Once out of range, the entire Royal Navy formed up in a US-style formation. Minelayers of all sizes trail the fleet, laying minefields to protect against U-Boats, those who weren't sent after the dummy convoy were sent to follow the real convoy heading for Britain. These would fall into the minefields, with a hefty %30 loss. The fleet makes it to Britain, but with the additional loss of the Exeter, Kenya, Nigeria, 7 destroyers, and 19 smaller vessels. Damages include the Illustrious, Barham, Suffolk, and 3 transports. Army personnel, now almost useless, are sent to flight school, where they learn the basics of flying, dogfighting, and ground attack. Aircraft start coming off the production lines, the most prominent being the Spitfire, Beaufighter, and Mosquito. During the delayed Battle of Britain, The cocky Luftwaffe bombers are sent in massive, loose formations in daylight. They sustain a surprising %75 loss rate after 3 runs. They switch to night attacks, and with radar-equipped ships off the coast, fighters, would achieve a still hefty %60 loss rate. The Germans try with fighters, but without better effect. Britain still wins the battle. All of the scraped metal from these aircraft are used to great effect by the British. Now, the U-Boats, without many targets, are sent to get rid of the RN around Britain, only to run into minefields, subchasers, aircraft, and as of early 1942, the USN. All of which are in concentrated forms now. U-Boats sustain a %47 loss rate. Still undaunted, Hitler orders the invasion of Britain. The invasion fleet sorties in late 1941, holding 27 transports, U-Boats, S-Boats/tenders, and the Bismarck, Tirpitz, Scharnhorst, and Gneisenau. British subs and MTBs attack with their own torpedoes, while aircraft take care of the U-Boats. When all is said and done, the Germans lose a transport, the Scharnhorst, 7 U-Boats, 12 S-Boats, and a tender. There are torpedoes and bombs in 8 more transports, the Tirpitz, the Gneisenau. 15 S-Boats, and 4 U-Boats are damaged. The Germans that do make it ashore run into the false shore batteries, and expecting a hail of fire, meet no resistance. They establish a beachhead, even under constant strafing by aircraft. When the transports leave to resupply, the RN aircraft carriers Ark Royal, Illustrious, Victorious, Formidable, Indomitable. They send 7 more transports to the bottom, as well as the Gneisenau, sent to escort them along with the Bismarck and Tirpitz. When more troops are being brought to Britain, the carriers, which are low on bombs, send out bombers to search out U-Boats with depth charges, and fighters to sink S-Boats. The Hood, KGV, Nelson, Rodney,Valiant, Malaya, Renown, POW, Repulse, Erebus, as well as heavy and light cruisers engage the convoy in a gun battle. The major escorts of the convoy are the Bismarck, Tirpitz, and cruisers Admiral Hipper, Prinz Eugen, a group of 8 destroyers, as well as 7 U-Boats, and 16 S-Boats/Tender. There are 15 transports. The U-Boats are engaged early on, with the loss of 4, and the other 3 damaged so badly they have to remain surfaced. The cruisers engage the destroyers and U-Boats, sinking 3 destroyers and the U-Boats, while damaging 4 more destroyers. They sustain the loss of the Danae to U-Boat torpedoes, and damage to the Dehli, Dragon, Belfast, and Erebus. with The battleships engage the enemy, concentrating and sinking the Bismarck and Tirpitz, with the loss of the Hood, Valiant, and Renown. The Admiral Hipper and Prinz Eugen sustain heavy damage before withdrawing, leaving the transports. The undamaged Nelson, Rodney, KGV, and POW go after these, along with the cruisers Edinburgh, Emerald, Jamaica, Norfolk, and US vessels Wichita, Tuscaloosa, Savannah, Vincennes, Augusta, Cincinnati, , battleships Texas, New York, Arkansas, New Mexico, Washington, and North Carolina. The USN ships were sent to Britain to aid in their defense, and have just arrived. The S-Boats that survived the onslaught go after the battleships, damaging the Repulse, nearly sinking her. They are all sunk after trying to go after the well-armed US vessels. The German infantry are left to starve under siege on the beaches of Britain, after only 4 transports are left from the original convoy of 15. After refueling in port, the USN destroyers run in during the middle of the night, sinking the transports with torpedoes while offloading supplies. The demoralized Germans on the beach try to call in air drops, the planes only to be shot down on the way to and from the drop zones by heavy naval and ground AA fire, as well as aircraft from the RAF/CAAC, and the FAA/USN (carrier Ranger came with the battle fleet.)

After these massive losses, a large internal resistance of the Gestapo, and top generals arrests Hitler and he dies in front of a firing squad. The top commanders work together to come up with a strategy. They drum up a last-ditch plan: use the Italian fleet, along with every possible U-Boat, to attack the fleet that are forming up in the British Channel. They assemble about 89 U-Boats, The battleships Vittorio, Roma, Vittorio Veneto, Giulio Cesare, Conte di Cavour, Andrea Doria, and Caio Duilio. Cruisers include the: Bari, Bolzano, Trieste, Trento, Zara, Fiume, Pola, Gorizia, Scipione Africano, Attilio Regolo, Attilo Regolo, Pompeo Magno, Alberto da Giussano, Alberico da Barbiano, Alberico da Barbiano, Giovanni dalle Bande Nere, Luigi Cadorna, Armando Diaz, Raimondo Montecuccoli, Muzio Attendolo, Emanuele Filiberto Duca d'Aosta, Eugenio di Savoia, Duca degli Abruzzi, and Giuseppe Garibaldi. The Germans also add on the Lützow, Admiral Scheer, Blücher, Schleswig-Holstein, Schlesien, Emden, Köln, Leipzig, Nürnberg, the newly repaired Admiral Hipper, and Prinz Eugen. The Italians also have a fleet of subs, corvettes, destroyers, and torpedo boats. Also At their disposal are the French vessels captured in France. This force is everything the Germans have left.

After hearing the news of Hitler's death, the world was ecstatic. Women began dancing in the streets, but the men were hard at work in Britain. With Hitler gone now, more experienced military leaders would run the show. With the men in the Pacific trapped in 1946, the build up of to liberate Europe can begin. Vessels, including aircraft carriers, are streaming in. Strangely though, aircraft production in the US has been slower than usual. A civil rights movement has begun, as the transportation issue in Philly has spread. Aircraft factories are hit hard. The large African-American work force are on strike, as the large white work force has needed transportation, and are leaving the blacks to walk to work, even if it is miles away.

The USN is sending 2 Essexes, 2 Midways, plus the new British designed Maltas to Britain. They, along with fleet that was just there, would spearhead their way to Europe. But, disaster strikes. Just as the Normandy invasion forces begin crossing the Channel, S-Boats fire torpedoes, damaging the escort craft that are supposed to be hunting the U-Boats. U-Boats and other Axis subs begin streaming into the Channel, from the north and south. From the North, German surface vessels, inder the cover of the Luftwaffe, will attack. The Italians will do the same from the South. The Italians, with more vessels, will slice into the convoy, and meet up with the Germans. The entire invasion force is split from their escorting carriers and battleships. The subs will sortie through the battle fleet, putting a single torpedo in as many vessels as they can. This is mostly against the carriers, so as to render their air cover as useless as possible. But they are instructed to not sink these ships, as when the Germans do win, they will have a grand navy. Aircraft rolling off decks at the angle the ships are listing. Battleships can't correctly aim their guns. Even with attempt to not sink any ships though, damage to some vessels, like the USS Charleston (Essex class), USS Monitor (Oregon City class), and HMS New Zealand (Malta class) are just too much. It threatens to capsize, so the signal is given to abandon ship. Destroyers pick up the many survivors, and go to work, towing back the damaged ships to Britain. %60 of the support fleet is gone, having to retire for repairs in Britain and the US. Only the Malta, Illustrious, Boxer (Essex class), and one of the 3 currently operational Habbakuk class carriers survive (USS Platts - my name of choice) The battleships KGV, Rodney, Nelson, Texas, and New York are left. Only nine cruisers are left. The losses are 1 light carrier (HMS Indomitable) 1 Battleship (HMS Queen Elizabeth) 2 Cruisers (HMAS Perth, USS Phoenix), and 7 Destroyers. The fleet is sent back, with the exception of the undamaged capital ships, and 31 destroyers. They are to trail the invasion fleet and take out U-Boat stalkers.The Invasion fleet is behind them, and is being turned around with the danger of U-Boats nearby. The Italian Fleet is busy setting up shop off Normandy, while The Germans go to the Paix de Caliais. AA ships are brought in, along with S-Boat and U-Boat tenders, which go on normal patrols to look for a prying enemy. More to come later, as I have to think more about it.

_________________
Current builds:
Hobby Boss 1/700 Type VIIC U-Boat for my AH

Planned builds:
3 more 1/700 AH submarines