The Ship Model Forum

hello all !

as I begin my 1936 SARTOGA, is ther any clues about grey color before 1937 ? (before #5 standard navy grey)

thank you !

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Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead! - David Glasgow Farragut

I've gone from WEM Colourcoats US01 #5 STANDARD NAVY GRAY in 14 ml tins to True North Enamels USN 1937 #5 STND NAVY GREY in 16 ml bottles . . . hope this helps.

Same as it was after 1937 - standard navy grey. Steel decks deck grey, flight deck mahogany flight deck stain

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Martin

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne

Ship Model Gallery

Let me try again. Confirming Martin's reply and this time answering your question directly, there are NO grey clues to Saratoga before 1937. According to Alan Raven's The Development of Naval Camouflage, Chapter IV, USN Inter-War research, the peacetime Navy adopted Standard Navy Gray #5 for vertical steel surfaces and Deck Gray #20 for horizontal steel surfaces. Some experiments were performed on a few DDs and SSs from 1934-38, prior to the major fleetwide changes in the 40s. My 1005 response is simply a personal model paint choice. Best wishes.

ok thank you !

I will assume #5 grey is valid for 1936 even if "officially" only from 1937.

by the way, I managed to do my own acrylic mix that is pretty damn close (dont dare to say "spot on" even if I think it ! ) to my S&S chip !

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Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead! - David Glasgow Farragut

Yes, that is correct.

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Martin

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne

Ship Model Gallery

Officially from 1921 to 1941. Some ships wore the earlier slate "War Color" that dated to 1898 or so until the late 1920s but it was largely due to budget cuts after WWI.

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Tracy White -Researcher@Large

"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
-Barbara Tuchman

Any Tamiya XF acrylic reasonably close to the #5 Standard Navy grey?

Come on guys! Still looking for some help!

Steve

You limited yourself to Tamiya. If there's not already some sort of match on the web there either isn't a good match or there aren't enough ship modelers doing that niche to have figured out a mix. Mixing and making formulas is one of my least favorite things to do and I have no problem jumping companies or types of paint, so I have no personal experience that will help you.

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Tracy White -Researcher@Large

"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
-Barbara Tuchman

Using the same browser, and comparing colors side by side, Tamiya XF54 Dark Sea Gray looks very close to S&S Standard Navy Gray #5 (1937).
https://www.sunwardhobbies.ca/tamiya-ac ... grey-gray/

Unfortunately there are different online depictions of that XF54 Dark Sea Grey - note Tamiya's official site shows it to be considerably darker than that shown on Sunward's site: https://www.tamiya.com/english/products/81754/index.htm

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De quoi s'agit-il?

It looks like it's pretty pointless to suggest, or research, a particular color based on internet images. I Googled several sites for Tamiya paint and they all showed different qualities and shades of the same colors - the same would apply to any brand of paint. Best thing to do is go to the LHS and compare colors to an accurate chip, unfortunately, paint colors don't always correspond exactly to the bottle cap.

Through 1923 there was a light gray and slate (very dark gray originating gin 1898). #5 standard navy gray was officially adopted in 1923. Documents can be found at NARA DC.

Tracy, would you happen to know of a good comparison to the "War Color"? Building a post WW1 USS Kansas.

I'm not Tracy, obviously, but from what I've seen, Euro I Gray FS 36081 is at least in the right ballpark. The important thing is, you want a neutral dark gray for War Color, since the only pigment in it (at least according to what I've read on the subject) was carbon.

White ensign still has stock of Colourcoats Slate. I haven't tried to compare or match it to anything, so El Santo's guess is as good as mine.

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Tracy White -Researcher@Large

"Let the evidence guide the research. Do not have a preconceived agenda which will only distort the result."
-Barbara Tuchman

Thank you both for your input. I ordered a couple of tins of Colourcoats.

I have a sample matched to the original. Very close match Vallejo Dark Grey (Gris Oscuro). Old number system 994 or 166 in rack position. It is neutral.

[quote="Jon C Ryckert"][quote="Tracy White"][quote="mister me"]I will assume #5 grey is valid for 1936 even if "officially" only from 1937.[/quote]

Officially from 1921 to 1941. Some ships wore the earlier slate "War Color" that dated to 1898 or so until the late 1920s but it was largely due to budget cuts after WWI.[/quote]

Tracy, would you happen to know of a good comparison to the "War Color"? Building a post WW1 USS Kansas.[/quote]