Calling all Soviet Kirov-class (Орлан) Project 1144 & Slava-class (Атлант) Project 1164 fans

[Ticonderoga]

That is one big piece of kit to deploy and even bigger to recover........

Good find Bruce, well done

Andrew

[carr]

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[Sauragnmon]

Why do I have a feeling it's not so much a dipping sonar as a towed array - remember, the original design for the Kirov Class was a heavy ASW platform in addition to other equipment.

[Ticonderoga]

Why do I have a feeling it's not so much a dipping sonar as a towed array - remember, the original design for the Kirov Class was a heavy ASW platform in addition to other equipment.

Nearly right. The correct nomenclature (in NATO at least) is Variable Depth Sonar (VDS). Typically the ship will have to slow, almost to a stop to deploy the body. Once in the water speed can be slowly increased, but top speed is severely restricted a) because of the nature of the tow and b) the sonar will not perform properly at much above 15 knots or so if you want to hear anything on the sonar. Maneuvering is also limited by the tow. Recovery also presents problems as the ship must almost stop to make the final recovery.

It is possible that one would set the VDS to the "in layer depth" and go active simply to deny the submariner that piece of ocean. It is also possible that the hull mounted sonar(s), operating in listen only mode, would hear any echoes generated by the VDS.

Remember the scene where the good guys figured out that the ruskies were driving Ramius to the hunters by "banging on everything they have"

Towed arrays are typically deployed from submarines. They are very very long cables fitted with an "array" of sonar transducers. These towed arrays only operate in listen mode. But due to their length, it is possible compute range without going active. the long array provides a good triangulation base. The "one ping only !" is a very rare thing in deed for a submariner to do.

The term "dipping Sonar" is typically used for the sonar that is deployed on the end of a cable from helicopters.

Andrew


PS convention says that the best weapon to fight a submarine with is another submarine, second best three or more Helicopters. There is not third best. Sending surface ships to prosecute a modern submarine has a very low rate of return.

[NorthSea]

I found this picture online recently, and have been pondering on the companionway shown (on Pyotr Velikiy).

I can't find it in any other pictures, not surprising as it would only show up from a few camera angles. So can anyone pinpoint the location? Anyone know of any other companionways?

[carr]

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[NorthSea]

Thanks Bob, is this it?

I take it there is a similar arrangement on the other side?

[carr]

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[Ticonderoga]

Here is a small end on shot of the Kashtan. Looks like the same barrel assembly as the older CIWS.


Andrew

[NorthSea]

Hi Andrew, I think that is the later version of Kashtan as fitted on Steregushchiy. You can see the addiitional support halfway along the gatling barrel that is not present on earlier versions I suspect the version on Pyotr Velikiy looks like this.

[Ticonderoga]

I agree mate, unfortunately the above is the only front end shot of a Kashtan I have that shows the barrels. I have at least two sets of drawings that shows the six barrels on the older version.

Andrew

[carr]

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[Ticonderoga]

Guys,

check this video out.

All in Russian but you get a couple of shots of the manufacturer's model and you see a couple of glimpses of the gun its self and it looks like six barrels to me around a central axis.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guVLqfiCfO4

Andrew

[carr]

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[NorthSea]

Good one! Nice to see the movement axes of the various mechanisms individually demonstrated. Also the missile reload sequence. Now Bob, do you have anything that shows the location of the missile magazine hatches on PV?

[Ticonderoga]

Hi NS,

I cannot be certain, but it is a pretty good guess that the magazine will be directly below the launch arms. See this video, it shows a reload sequence.

I think each magazine has 3 reloads of eight missiles (24) no doubt the there is an additional magazine(s) some were else in the ship that will be used to manually reload the auto magazine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXYWBIru ... re=related

Andrew

[NorthSea]

I think you mean directly below the launch arms when the Kashtan is pointed directly to the side. There would seem to be an obvious downside to the weapon: while reloading the missile racks you will disable the gatling and probably be unable to track and acquire targets. So having the reload magazines positioned as described should reduce the cycle time for the most likely threats directly off the beam. Anyone want to speculate if Russian fire control can avoid having all Kashtan systems needing simultaneous reload?

[carr]

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[Ticonderoga]

Lovely pictures Bob, I had not seen the last two before, thanks for posting

Andrew

[NorthSea]

Thanks Bob, the last Kashtan picture is new to me and has a good view of some features I hadn't seen before. In the middle picture there is no sign of the multiple barrels at the business end of the weapon, but I guess they must be in there somewhere.