Calling all Fletcher-class (DD-445) fans

[whaynes]

I'm building LaValette as she was in Oct. 1942. The O'Bannon plans are as she was in Aug. 1942. This was before they had any significant modifications other than addition of a twin 40mm to LaValette's Stern and removal of 2 of her 20mm's. I'm referring to vents, drains, etc.

Walt

[Rick E Davis]

Walt,

As Dick said ... when do you wish to model La Vallette? Both Bath Iron Works and Federal SB&DD used the same drawings from Gibbs and Cox to build Fletchers. La Vallette photographic coverage is fairly well documented except for a couple of periods. Well, between the time I started to type/put this together ... you answered that question.

The first image is of La Vallette being delivered to the USN on 11 August 1942. Note that the twin 40-mm mount and radars have yet to be installed. At this time she was equipped for six 20-mm guns. Her home yard, New York Navy Yard, will finish fitting her out.

The second image is of La Vallette a few weeks later on 5 September, after the twin 40-mm mount in the high tub and the fantail twin 40-mm mount have been installed. But, note that the ship has had her superstructure repainted with Haze Gray and that the Mk 51 directors are not installed. Also, at this point she has had her 20-mm gun armament reduced to four as compensation for the fantail 40-mm mount. This was likely taken when La Vallette ran her Inspection Trials and she would have returned to the yard to finish any installs not completed ... plus go into drydock and have her hull repainted.

The third image about a month later on 8 October, shows that the Mk 51 directors have been installed and she has been repainted in Ms 22. This would likely be how she looked during Operation Torch.

La Vallette returned to the East Coast in December and according to Armament Summary data had a 20-mm added before the bridge on an elevated centerline platform. She departed the East Coast about 16 December 1942 and arrived in the war zone in the South Pacific about 15 December 1943. La Vallette was torpedoed on 30 January 1943 by Japanese aircraft and returned to Mare Island on 1 April for repairs. When she left Mare Island in late July, she had been updated with five twin 40-mm mounts. I have found no confirmed photos of La Vallette when she was in the South Pacific for the first "SIX WEEK" tour to the Solomons and don't know how many 20-mm guns "likely" were added ... one (or two like DeHaven?) atop the pilothouse would seem reasonable and two "could" have been added amidships. Basically, she had somewhere between five to eight 20-mm guns during that period.

[whaynes]

Thanks, I've pretty much desided that I'm going to use the plans of O'Bannon and photos from my sources and do the "best guess" method to add pipe and vent details I'm not really sure about. It will give it extra detail and depth, and I will like the way it looks.

Walt

[Rick E Davis]

Walt,

I don't think you will go wrong doing that. The earliest built BIW and Federal ships appear to me to be nearly identical, so equipment and things like splinter bulwarks would appear to same. It was after construction continued, new configurations evolved, and the number of builders expanded to other private yards, that details changed.

By the way, I have a few New York Navy yard photos of La Vallette taken on 8 October 1942. If you need a view of a particular area, let me know and I'll see if I can find something to answer the question. I have nothing below the waterline however.

Good luck.

[whaynes]

Rick, I would really like to see any pictures you have of LaValette during that time. You can e-mail if you like.

Walt

[Rotorhead]

Hull Condenser Intake Detail

From my searching, it appears that the very best source for lower hull detail is the USS Kidd in Baton Rouge as she sits out of the water during the winter months. The hull openings are sealed but one would get a feel for the location and the basic shape of openings. The lower hull just hasn't been the sexiest place to take photos and post for all to see on the internet. Looking at some basic blueprints and Kidd hull photos I am reasonably sure "where" the intakes are. I am a little weak on thier shapes.

Photo of the port side with lightened areas of port Fwd intake:



Photo of the area of the Stbd Aft Intake (back on the underside below the bilge keel):



These intakes are getting to be so far up under the hull that they just might not be worth the effort to model them. The discharges are a different story.

Regards
Steve

[Rotorhead]

OK, I'll shut up now about the condenser intakes.

I finally "figured" out about the Condenser intakes, or scoops on the early Fletchers. I got a peek at some plans for the Fletcher and the photos of the USCGC Taney's intake is close. The Fletcher's has 2 splitter fins instead of the one in the Taney, is 20+ inches wide and 4'6" + long. They are located inboard of the propeller shaft centerline and just forward of thier respective fireroom. The intake pipe angles up and aft acting as a scoop when steaming ahead. I do not know if there is or was a screen attached.

Here is the Taney's intake again.



The Taney website says there was a screen attached. I saw no notation on the Fletcher plan for a screen.

Regards
Steve

[Rick_H]

Steve,
I submit that since the purpose of the condenser is to collect the nearly expended steam (and thus it sits under the low pressure turbine assembly) and since the Fletcher's arrangement was to have firerooms forward of enginerooms, that you would find your condenser inlets just aft of the respective fireroom.

The LP turbine was located on the port side of the after engineroom and the stbd side of the fwd engineroom.

Rick Heinbaugh

[Rotorhead]

Hello Rick,

You made me look at my last post and I found an error in my typing. I said "forward of their respective firerooms". I meant to say of their respective enginerooms. I found in further research that there are 2 condenser intakes (per engineroom). A round one just under the "main circulation pump"..............which sits about 10 feet behind the scoop...which appears to angle itself through the bulkhead under the fireroom to the belly.

Regards
Steve

[whaynes]

I need a little help with painting a measure 22 scheme on DD-448, USS LaVallette. Is the top of the Mk 37 Director in Haze Gray or Deck Blue, as the tops of the 5 in turrets are painted? Thanks, Walt Haynes

[Rick E Davis]

Walt,

My first reaction was to say the flat area would be painted like the tops of the 5-in gun mounts and the rest the same color as the vertical surfaces. But, to be sure I decided to find a photo or two. Well, it took me awhile to find an overhead view showing the Mk 37 director. A little different than I thought from looking at profile views of several other ships. Here is a view of Philip (DD-498) being delivered from her builder ... Federal ... which was the same builder as La Vallette. But, La Vallette was delivered in Ms 12 camo scheme and was repainted to Ms 22 by New York Navy Yard and they MAY have had a little different style. But, looking at the profile view of La Vallette (close crop below) it appears that she had her Mk 37 painted the same way. So the flat and the first "slope" were painted deck blue.

Interesting that in at least one late 1945 view I looked at, just the flat area was painted.

[whaynes]

Rick, thanks for the quick reply. That helps a lot. Walt

[eraphael]

Hi!
Where can I find more photographic coverage of this destroyer?
I'm doing her before it's 44' refit, specifically during the 42-43
Guadalcanal ops.
Thanks!

[Rick E Davis]

If all questions could be this easy ... ... go to DestroyerHistory.org, O'Bannon's sister, Nicholas, was one of the most photographed Fletchers during the war. The opening page to O'Bannon is on this page ...

http://www.destroyerhistory.org/fletche ... index.html

And the opening page for Nicholas is on this page ...

http://www.ussnicholas.org/index.html

[eraphael]

Thanks as always Rick.
So I can use the Nicholas detail shots for the O'Bannon?
Eli

[Rick E Davis]

Nicholas and O'Bannon were close sisters in configuration through much of the war. Both Nicholas and O'Bannon had quad 1.1-in mounts and both had in early 1943 ten 20-mm guns. They left the East coast with six 20-mm guns. Four more were added in the South Pacific: one atop the pilothouse, and two at least on Nicholas, then changed to three to the fantail with only a couple of small bulwarks for the onboard 20-mm guns of the set on the fantail.

Here is an image of O'Bannon reportedly taken on 3 February 1943.

[Tracy White]

I just realized that I never got around to posting the design sheets I have to the Shipcamouflage Database Fletcher Page, an omission that has been largely fixed. I have two more sheets yet to add and some that we don't have, but it should be a good start for everyone.

[Dave Hill]

Hi all!,

Can anyone tell me if the 1945 "Anti-Kamikaze" AA fit was a feature of all Fletcher's at the time or limited to just a select few ships only?...if so...would there be a listing of the "anti-kamikaze" ships?...Thanks!!!!!!

Dave

[Tracy White]

No feature was "all ships" as they were out fighting a war and there was no way the US could pull them all back at once to make modifications. Rather, standards were set and ships were modified to those standards when they came in for repair or overhaul. I would suggest reading some of the posts on page ten of this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=49&t=8105&p=156076#p156076

[Dave Hill]

Thanks Tracy thats just what I was looking for!!!!!!!!

Also I want to get the Fletcher class e-book CD from the Floating Drydock...I have an older computer with 512mb of RAM and a 30gb HD will I have any problems running the CD on my machine?...TIA!!!!!

Dave