kidcurrie42 wrote:Hiya Guys,
My next build after my 1939 USS Lexington is to be a 1944 USS Enterprise, a few questions that i hope can be answered,
The Anti torpedo bulge, was it the same shape on both sides ?
What was her AA fit for this period, and is there anywhere that shows all the positions ?
Great builds on here guys, i am using both the Tamiya Hornet and Enterprise kits for this build.
Happy Modeling
John
Hi John,
1. Blisters were symmetrical.
2. Try cv6.org on the quick & dirty, this page in particular: http://www.cv6.org/ship/1944view.htm. O/W, the Floating Drydock 1944 CV-6 plan is your friend.
John, just one caveat about that CV6.org drawing. The 40mm mount directly aft of the island (the higher of the two there) is a twin, not a quad as the drawing shows. A quad would not clear at that location due to the big crane. The ones all around the forward flight deck and the forepeak are twins, the pair aft on either side of the flight deck are twins, the quads are the pair of tubs in front of the island, the lower tub aft of the island and the one in the starboard catwalk sponson, along with the pair at the hangar deck sponson, port quarter.
Michael's absolutely right about that. Also, please note that the late 1945 info on the 40MM is incorrect; I used Friedman's book for that, as, at the time, I couldn't tell from photos what was mounted. Friedman's info is what was planned, but not what was installed, There were only 8 quad 40's installed, two of them replacing twins forward. The additional three quads were to have been mounted on the port side, in the former forward catapult sponson and in a new sponson roughly amidships. Apprently this wasn't done. I believe stability concerns may have been the reason.
Rich Mathsen wrote:The additional three quads were to have been mounted on the port side, in the former forward catapult sponson and in a new sponson roughly amidships. Apprently this wasn't done. I believe stability concerns may have been the reason.
They actually were installed. But by that time, the war ended. Enterprise was scheduled to head to the east coast, so anything that projected too far out had to be removed. The three quad 40MM you listed were among those projections. Also, the outer extremes of the forward flightdeck 40MM tubs had to be shaved off to fit through the canal. Unfortunately, most if not all of the photos taken after the refit were enroute to Panama, and so were after the "shaving". If you look at those photos, the vestiges of the three tub supports are visible.
Dick J - on the money! I have only been able to find one photo of her, actually taken in drydock in Bremerton, that shows her before the tubs were shaved for Panama Canal transit. Look closely, and you will see the full tubs forward, and the quads on the portside forward sponson. That might even be the one farther back for the third quad also visible with a squint or two! It is at CV6.org, go to image library, June 1945. Here is the URL, because I cannot seem to get it to show up in the post:
Edited by Tracy: Direct link to the page in question added - embedding images from CV-6.org is blocked. Viewers want to look at the current last image, ID barr-img-92
Here are a couple of photos from the Enterprise Battle Damage report post-Santa Cruz. It shows to good detail, the modified bow tub that was converted from an oval shaped tub for two 20MM's to a quad 1.1" mount. This was done after Midway to both CV-6 and CV-8. CV-6 got a tiny director tub, which CV-8 did not, and is the subject of some puzzling over where CV-8 had her director for this tub located - see the CV-8 thread (postscript, CV-8 never had a director for her bow 1.1"- confirmed in her after action report of Santa Cruz). Anyway, the hull shows damage from a bomb that passed through the flight deck, the foc'sle deck and the hull and exploded close aboard the port bow, causing shrapnel damage to the hull and degaussing cables. Don't know about you, buy my hat gets tipped to anybody that manned that director tub in battle. Kind of like a seagoing counterpart to a B-17's ball turret.
Last edited by Michael Vorrasi on Thu Aug 05, 2010 3:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Metal on the edges of the holes on the hull in bent inwards, what to my oppinion suggest, that it was a miss ot the bom and explosion on the sea near the Big E, if the bomb would explode inside the ship, metal on the edges would be bent outwards... just my personal oppinion...
tomcat Fanatic wrote:Metal on the edges of the holes on the hull in bent inwards, what to my oppinion suggest, that it was a miss ot the bom and explosion on the sea near the Big E, if the bomb would explode inside the ship, metal on the edges would be bent outwards... just my personal oppinion...
Yes and no. According to the damage report, the bomb passed through the ship and detonated immediately after exiting. That only requires one hole with the plate bent outward. All other holes would, as you indicated, be bent inward. The physical contact with the ship was necessary to initiate the fuse on the bomb. Detonation upon contact with the water would have produced a damage pattern closer to the waterline.
Dick J wrote:That only requires one hole with the plate bent outward.
Looks like the exit hole is right under the degaussing cable? The bottom two seem to be bent outward. Or is that something else? I don't see anything like that on the stbd side, just the port.
I am in the later stages of building my 1/144 scale USS enterprise CV-6. What and undertaking this project turned out to be! You can see updated photos of the ship at carrierbuilders.net in the articles section. I posted new pics to the site today 1/6/2010. They should be posted by the 7th. anyone wishing to contact me can reach me at randallreynolds@ymail.com.
Dick J wrote:That only requires one hole with the plate bent outward.
Looks like the exit hole is right under the degaussing cable? The bottom two seem to be bent outward. Or is that something else? I don't see anything like that on the stbd side, just the port.
Bob
Guys, just to end the controversy, the bomb went through the flight deck, through the foc'sle deck and through the outer hull before exploding close aboard OUTSIDE of the hull just after exiting. That is why the shrapnel holes go inward. The report has a photo of the hole made by the bomb as it passed through the foc'sle deck, but the photo was rather unremarkable, so I didn't upload it. The exit hole is right under the front of the portside degaussing cable. The bomb was travelling with about a 30 to 40 degree forward slant as it passed through the ship. Its path is diagrammed in the report.
I've taken the plunge and started converting the 1/350 Trumpeter kit of the Hornet to the Enterprise. The model will depict her late in the war, but I haven't decided on the paint job yet. The first order of business is chopping up the hull to fix the bow profile as much as possible. I'll be building it waterline, in part to halve the amount of work needed to fix the hull. I figured that the easiest way was to cut off the front bottom tip of the bow, then squeeze the bottom of the hull together and secure it with big staples. After some trial and error, I think the work has gone fairly well so far. The staples are made from 3/32" aluminum rod bent into a U shape and passed through holes drilled in the cross members in lower part of the hull and through the bow itself. To keep the top part of the hull at the right spacing, brass spreader bars were used. Naturally, such warping of the hull will throw off the fit of the hangar deck parts and the forecastle part, so I'll be adjusting the fit of those. While I'm warping the hull, the aft 5" gun galleries are too close to each other by about 5mm, so I'll be pushing these apart as well.
On the red circles, what are these suppose to be?
Can they be the 24� searchlights.
To me they don�t look like 20mm AA.
I know the pictures are not clear and can hardly tell what it is.
Can anyone clarify this? Or at least a guess?
Also how many arresting gears and barricades did CV-6 had?
On the red circles, what are these suppose to be?
Can they be the 24� searchlights.
To me they don�t look like 20mm AA.
I know the pictures are not clear and can hardly tell what it is.
Can anyone clarify this? Or at least a guess?
Also how many arresting gears and barricades did CV-6 had?
Thanks in advance.
Apollo
Hi Apollo, those circled items are indeed 20mm single tubs. At this time frame, Enterprise had two single tubs in either catwalk aft of the 5 inch batteries. The port side pair were separated by the LSO platform and safety net. The tubs were directly opposite their mates on the other side of the deck. If you see a clear printed copy of ONI-54, which is where those photos were scanned from, you can see that they are 20MM tubs. They may look a bit odd because of the angles of the splinter shields and how light is reflecting off them, and also by several crewmen clustered about them when the photos were taken. If you have Steve Ewing's book, see page 51, top photo. You can clearly see the two tubs you circled are 20mm mounts.
As built, the Yorktowns had 22 cross deck pendants (arrestor wires) spaced along the entire length of the flight deck. The Yorktowns could land aircraft from either end and were designed to be able to launch and recover steaming in reverse. They had nine two-wire crash barriers that were arranged through the midship section of the flight deck. I do believe that CV-6 had the cross deck pendants reduced in number after her mid-war refit, but I'll have to double check that.
Addition, 10-8-10: A link to the photo that appears in Ewing book, p.51 that I referred to. Compare silhouette of the questioned position (a 20MM) to the five on the deck edge upper right. Same. The splinter shield shows clearly.
Last edited by Michael Vorrasi on Fri Oct 08, 2010 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
